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Thread: MPH Challenge

  1. #321
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    Snook am surprised that your not working for traxxas yet, the quality of work on this thing is unreal! If you worked on the XO-1 when in development it'd be pushing 150 out of the box

  2. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevoReaper View Post
    Snook am surprised that your not working for traxxas yet, the quality of work on this thing is unreal! If you worked on the XO-1 when in development it'd be pushing 150 out of the box
    Or running your own company making parts for these trucks, from what I have seen an read you have great ideas and great work, I would love a 3 speed tranny but I don't think I could make one.
    1/10 Slash 4X4 VXL
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  3. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by tatsuvw View Post
    Or running your own company making parts for these trucks, from what I have seen an read you have great ideas and great work, I would love a 3 speed tranny but I don't think I could make one.
    Snook if I could ask, the 3 speed and now 4 speed tranny's that you have designed, do you run them in your bashers? How reliable do they hold up. I am just curious to see if these designs only work in purpose built cars like your 100mph build
    Slayer Pro turned Revo

  4. #324
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Snook Man's Avatar
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    I run a 3 speed in a basher all the time. It holds up just as well as any standard 2.5 transmission with an FOC, all the gears are basically the same except for 3rd gear.
    Unless I’m doing speed runs in the street it will rarely hit 3rd.

    I haven’t actually made a 4 speed (yet), I just figured out a way to do it with the modified 2.5 transmission case.
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  5. #325
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    I remember asking you this in the past, but what was involved in making the Revo tranny a 3-speed?
    Slayer Pro turned Revo

  6. #326
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    You would have to modify the transmission housing (lengthen it, not an easy task) and then custom fit it to the revo chassis. The extra length needed to install the extra gears moves the front of the transmission forward. The front center shaft has to be shortened along with a slight adjustment of the brake linkage.
    Same thing with the Tmaxx grey transmission. It is more compact than the black transmission and it has to be lengthened to fit the extra gears and clutch hub.
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  7. #327
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Snook Man's Avatar
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    Got front down force?

    Just a mock-up but I got tired of waiting for the XO-1 front splitter to become available so I could modify it to fit my purpose and decided to make my own canard type splitter.

    Iíve been thinking about this for a while and dug out an old proline rear wing and started cutting it to fit the front bumper mount.
    I basically cut it in Ĺ, removed a portion of the bottom of the side plates and drilled it to mount it to the bumper mount.
    Once I make a custom body I will contour the excess inner part of the wing to fit around the curve of the body instead of the body fitting it.







    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  8. #328
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    Are you putting an reinforcement in that splitter snook? With the center section removed isnt it a bit flexable so that that canards will contact the ground at speed?

  9. #329
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Snook Man's Avatar
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    As it sits I can push down on the canards and fully compress the shocks to where the center of the bumper mount hits the ground with out the canards flexing too much (the bumper mount extends out to the outside of the wheels and adds support).
    It takes 6 lbs of down force to compress the suspension to the ground in the front, and 8 lbs of force to compress the rear. Keeping the front lower than the rear will create down force under the chassis.
    If more than that amount of force is created I will have to adjust the springs and shock oil to suite and then add a brace for the canards or reduce the size/angle of the canards and rear spoiler to decrease the force.
    I really have no way of knowing for certain how much force will be created with the body I will make or the splitter/canards.
    I will just have to slowly build up to speed during the initial testing to work out the bugs and see if chassis starts to drag or lift. I have a few pieces of 2mm titanium that I can mount to the underside of the chassis; if it drags the sparks will let me know I was close to bottoming out.
    I will probably start the testing with just a standard 2 speed then install the 3 speed once Iím comfortable with the handling and it being mechanically fit.
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  10. #330
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    For ground clearance testing you can also use painters tape. It will easily show any scuffs, will not change weight distribution or ground clearance and I am sure it will be a lot less work to install and remove. I have seen it used on late model race cars.

  11. #331
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    It's getting closer Snook.... Funny thing man.... I just can't stop thinking about your twin leaf blower wind tunnel..... For some reason I can't get that out of my head....

    Honestly, if there was a "Thinking outside of the box" award, you would win it!!!

    Can't wait for the next update!
    All Lives Matter

  12. #332
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Snook Man's Avatar
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    Tank,
    The only problem with using tape is it only tells you that you have bottomed out.
    I may forgo the Ti and just use some modelerís clay that way it would give me some idea of distance from the chassis to the ground if it wears away.

    Rob, I had the leaf blowers out about an hour ago watching the front end compressÖ
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  13. #333
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    I guess I don't follow how adding titanium or clay to the underside will tell you anything since you will be effectively reducing ground clearence and possibly getting a false positive. If you hit the tape then you definitely are bottomming out and can quickly adjust, retape and test again. Please don't get me wrong you are a T-Maxx Master in my mind but I always ask a question if I have one.

  14. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tankdg View Post
    I guess I don't follow how adding titanium or clay to the underside will tell you anything since you will be effectively reducing ground clearence and possibly getting a false positive. If you hit the tape then you definitely are bottomming out and can quickly adjust, retape and test again. Please don't get me wrong you are a T-Maxx Master in my mind but I always ask a question if I have one.
    I get why he is doing it, using tape only shows that you are bottoming out, if the titanium wears to .5mm and then stops wearing snook knows that there is .5mm clearance so at maximum speed he can have the suspension set with minimal clearance, but still clearance. If it bottoms on the tape and you lift it up, you could lift it to far without realising and there is no way of measuring the height of the car at speed.

  15. #335
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Snook Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevoReaper View Post
    there is no way of measuring the height of the car at speed.
    Thatís exactly why.
    I believe the clay will work the best but it will not be as impressive to watch as the sparks from the Ti.

    As it sits, with a mockup body buttoned up as much as possible, at rest and with about 1/3 compression of the suspension I get a lot of air under the chassis blowing out the back.
    When I compress the suspension to about Ĺ way or more, the flow of air under and out the back is dramatically reduced. I donít know why, but at a certain point of compression (just before Ĺ way) itís like a switch is flipped and the air is all at once being diverted over the top. I guess itís just the point at which the aerodynamics kick in and have the biggest effect. It may be a good thing, it may not be.
    Once I determine what clearance I have at speed with the clay I can set the shocks up to where they are they are just shy of bottoming out with limiters and still have some clearance between the chassis and tarmac and a little more travel of the suspension for the bumps at high speed.
    Thereís a fine line with the front suspension, with only about ĺ inch total suspension travel at rest and when the chassis bottoms out a few mmís will mean a lot.
    Just a change of the springs on the front to a lighter spring rate and the leaf blower will slam the chassis down fully compressed, or a heavier rate will not show any movement at all except for the flex of the splitter and canards.

    Then, once I make the mold for the real body, itís all likely to change again
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  16. #336
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    I see a few issues with both the titanium and the clay, but there will be pros and cons for any method used
    How do you fix it to the chassis? Titanium will need to use screws/nuts and bolts and will have some protrusion at some point stopping it from contacting the road, or double sided tape that will add some extra distance. Clay, same problem in a way, what will stop the whole piece being ripped off on first contact?
    Weight, not so much the titanium but at the speeds your looking at, every few grams will make a difference and the clay is relatively heavy by size, but then this could work as a safety buffer in stopping it from bottoming out at all once removed.
    The pliability of the clay could allow it to flex and distort under a quick bottom out and then slightly return to original shape.

    What about some of that expanding foam that sets hard? Shape a piece that hooks on the front of the splitter, is fragile enough that it will wear quickly but also has a fair bit of strength and is as light as the titanium. You could also make a couple of extra and put them on the canards for even more info.

  17. #337
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    You have a tread mill that you could hook a motor up to for high speeds? That way you can have a stationary car, use your "wind tunnel" and can see the effects of aerodynamics without driving the car down the street.
    Just to add, I can only imagine what your wife would say when you lug that thing out to the garage...
    Last edited by Double G; 02-29-2012 at 05:06 PM.
    The Super Derecho

  18. #338
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    Treadmill would be no good, no surface variation at all, nice smooth surface. In reality snook needs to build this thing to run in the real world. Even the smoothest road has slight variations, enough to cause suspension movement from the rocks in the pavement, a small pebble that was missed in the pre run check could be disastrous. Also the down force produced is going to change dependant on speed, if snooks leaf blowers push air at 70mph and the car goes 100mph there is going to be almost 30% more air flow over the car producing alot more downforce. Also leaf blowers are hard to re-create the small wind shifts that you will encounter while running to see the effects of that. A small (1-3mph) cross wind will have some effect on the handling of the car.

  19. #339
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    Subscribed! Killer work my man!

  20. #340
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    I can't wait to see this... But I'm kinda confused on how the difficulty of this project seams so elevated. I've seen vids of a jato doing 93.3 and with no body, re-geared and with a body it might have done a hundred. Or that vid of the rc crashing at 103. They hit a bill with a nitro RC. I like the enthusiasm of the project, but fail to see the difficulty of the project. I'm betting I'm just missing it, so could you explain, I am new to the RC world.

  21. #341
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jbat View Post
    I can't wait to see this... But I'm kinda confused on how the difficulty of this project seams so elevated. I've seen vids of a jato doing 93.3 and with no body, re-geared and with a body it might have done a hundred. Or that vid of the rc crashing at 103. They hit a bill with a nitro RC. I like the enthusiasm of the project, but fail to see the difficulty of the project. I'm betting I'm just missing it, so could you explain, I am new to the RC world.
    Dont take this the wrong way but how much experience, hands on, have you had with custom built speed cars? Once you hit 70+mph every extra mph becomes increasingly harder to achieve. So many people have tried to hit 100, but out of them only a handful have achieved it, and even less have achieved it with a car that can be used for more than a pass or 2 before breaking something. Snook is building a ground up speed machine, not sticking a massive motor in a factory car and hoping it will hold together, as well as sharing every step of the build so that if others are considering the same thing they can learn from what he has done. Getting a rc to 100mph, have it stable and controllable, takes alot of work on the down force, suspension and weight distribution before you think about the motor. Add to that the 3 speed, twin nitro's and other customizations this thing is one of a kind and has more chance of working on the first run than most other custom builds as well as smashing the 100 mark

  22. #342
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    The video of the rc doing 103 and wiping out is an electric car. With today's technology is it easier to get an electric car to 100mph. Which is why it is so awesome that Snook is going to beat that with nitro.
    Joshua 24:15 Choose this day who ye will serve

  23. #343
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    Jbat,
    If you haven't you must read the entire post. I know it is long but it is quite entertaining.

  24. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jbat View Post
    I can't wait to see this... But I'm kinda confused on how the difficulty of this project seams so elevated. I've seen vids of a jato doing 93.3 and with no body, re-geared and with a body it might have done a hundred. Or that vid of the rc crashing at 103. They hit a bill with a nitro RC. I like the enthusiasm of the project, but fail to see the difficulty of the project. I'm betting I'm just missing it, so could you explain, I am new to the RC world.
    I don't think this is some kind of World record attempt, and Snook is not using something out of the box either. It's a project with pretty much a scratch build. +1 read this ENTIRE post.....

    Not many people out ther can design and machine their own parts...... Put them together in a way that they actually work well on an engineering level..... You come to appreciate the true work and the amount of thought going into this project.
    All Lives Matter

  25. #345
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    I agree it takes alot of thought and time and most of all patience doing this build to hit 100mph w/nitro. i sure dont have the skill to cut and make the parts let alone design your own parts like Snook as. maybe in time and after this thread as had all the updates and after the nitro car has hit the goal then i will have the know how on how to build a car to go that fast but its ingenius what Snook is doing. Follow this everyday for progress and updates.
    DEU 8:18 ESV

  26. #346
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitronaught View Post
    I don't think this is some kind of World record attempt
    I dont think its purposefully an attempt, but i think snook could at least give the nitro record a scare with this kind of setup.

  27. #347
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    I had some time to work on the build today.

    I think I am pretty much finished with the front splitter assembly.
    It was a little more difficult than I thought it would be to get everything the way I envisioned it.

    I made a filler to go between the front bumper mount and the tires and then cut away the remaining part of the wing so it would fit the outline of where the body will be.

    Once I cut the excess off the wing it lost a lot of rigidly and I had to re-think the whole thing.
    I made another filler plate and raised it 6mm off the main chassis deck and cut it to fit the outline of the bumper mount and let it extend flush with the bottom and under a portion of the wing extensions and act as a brace.
    I mounted a curved portion of another bumper cut to size in the outline that the body will follow to keep the body from flexing in at speed.
    The body will follow the outline of the curve (yellow line) and once it gets to the point at which the canards and plate meet (red arrow) it will start angling downward and follow the outline around the tires to the main chassis plate.


    I was going to cut out the body wheel wells for wheel clearance when making hard turns but since I am making my own body I have decided to not cut it out and just mask it off when painting. That should help keep out unnecessary air and you will still be able to see the wheels/tires through the clear body (I will do the same in the rear). If I find itís unnecessary or not working as planned I can always cut the wheel well section out and still have a flared fender look.
    When testing, the canards divert the air pretty substantially so the flared fenders shouldnít cause any more drag.

    I also laid out the design for the chassis side plate extensions to be cut away.
    All the triangles marked with blue tape will be removed.
    Its hard to get a clear pic of the scribe lines on the shiny aluminum


    My work schedule is full for a few weeks and I wonít get much accomplished for a while, but more parts should be in by that time.
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  28. #348
    RC Qualifier MooseSlash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snook Man View Post
    I had some time to work on the build today.

    I think I am pretty much finished with the front splitter assembly.
    It was a little more difficult than I thought it would be to get everything the way I envisioned it.

    I made a filler to go between the front bumper mount and the tires and then cut away the remaining part of the wing so it would fit the outline of where the body will be.

    Once I cut the excess off the wing it lost a lot of rigidly and I had to re-think the whole thing.
    I made another filler plate and raised it 6mm off the main chassis deck and cut it to fit the outline of the bumper mount and let it extend flush with the bottom and under a portion of the wing extensions and act as a brace.
    I mounted a curved portion of another bumper cut to size in the outline that the body will follow to keep the body from flexing in at speed.
    The body will follow the outline of the curve (yellow line) and once it gets to the point at which the canards and plate meet (red arrow) it will start angling downward and follow the outline around the tires to the main chassis plate.


    I was going to cut out the body wheel wells for wheel clearance when making hard turns but since I am making my own body I have decided to not cut it out and just mask it off when painting. That should help keep out unnecessary air and you will still be able to see the wheels/tires through the clear body (I will do the same in the rear). If I find it’s unnecessary or not working as planned I can always cut the wheel well section out and still have a flared fender look.
    When testing, the canards divert the air pretty substantially so the flared fenders shouldn’t cause any more drag.

    I also laid out the design for the chassis side plate extensions to be cut away.
    All the triangles marked with blue tape will be removed.
    Its hard to get a clear pic of the scribe lines on the shiny aluminum


    My work schedule is full for a few weeks and I won’t get much accomplished for a while, but more parts should be in by that time.
    Wow! That looks like a cool project!
    And there he goes with the carbon...

  29. #349
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    Getting closer snook I was interested to see how you would get around the splitter flexing, i've filmed the rear end of a buggy doing 70+mph and the wing was bent like a banana from the pressure. Other thing you could use to strengthen the splitter is a piece of carbon fiber flat, should be able to pick some up "pretty cheap" at you LHS if they deal with planes and heli's

  30. #350
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    Hey Snook, just going off of what RevoReaper said, I am pretty sure that Vantage Racing make Carbon Fibre rear spoilers, that would not flex at all and would be very light, something to consider, and that front spoiler I would image would bend too, maybe carbon fibre would help their also?
    Slayer Pro turned Revo

  31. #351
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    looking good.....
    Traxxas is good, but so are other Manus

  32. #352
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    I had though about using a CF wing; I just didn’t have one to hack up.
    With the aluminum filler/brace installed it stiffened the splitter up really well and the chassis will bottom out before the canards begin to flex.
    Not all the down force will be created by the canards; the nose of the body will have a pretty extreme angle that will help distribute the force.
    I do have some CF plate I can inlay under the wing to help stiffen up the canards if necessary.
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  33. #353
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    Itís been a while since I had the chance to work on the build but today I had the time to cut out the designs in the side plates to lighten the load.
    It looks pretty good with the design cut outs and the weight of the plates was reduced by almost Ĺ.
    I had planned on using a self adhesive shrink wrap to cover the bottom of the plates to keep the air out but I received a sample piece and it is a lot heavier than I expected it to be and I will need to find a lighter weight material.
    I used some tape I have on hand for testing procedures I perform for work to cover the bottom to see how it looked and was surprised when I realized I had completely overlooked the fact the once the tape is applied the sticky side will collect anything that falls on to it. I can believe I overlooked that little detailÖI will probably just apply a transparent tape on the top to keep the adhesive relatively clean. I donít think there is any need for a shrink wrap as the tape alone is pretty taut.
    There is a sign/print shop down the road from me that I will see if they can make a bumper sticker type application that I can use made from a HD vinyl material and have something printed on it like flames or some sort of a cool design.





    I should have a few days next week to do a little more to it.
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  34. #354
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    What can i say but every time you update this thread i am in awe of your work mate. Am hanging for the finished product

  35. #355
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    Cant wait to see the finish product and hopefully a video of the run it makes.
    4 Maxx
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  36. #356
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    Did you make those cutouts by hand? Unbelievable if you did.

    Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk
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  37. #357
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRXnewbie21 View Post
    Did you make those cutouts by hand? Unbelievable if you did.

    Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk
    Yes, he did it all by hand.
    Matthew 7:7

  38. #358
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    Double post deleted - Chevy
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  39. #359
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    Quote Originally Posted by TRXnewbie21 View Post
    Did you make those cutouts by hand? Unbelievable if you did.
    Power tools!
    Every aluminum part I made with this build was cut out with a variable speed jig saw with a metal blade (table saw for the long straight cuts when possible). Then I use a variety of carbide dremel bits chucked in a drill press to grind/finish to the scribe line and then finish with a small drum sander in the press.

    Any one can do it if you have a little patience/practice and make a sacrificial cutting board.My method after trying many different ways.
    I usually frame a 2x4 box a little larger than the piece Iím cutting and attach a piece of scrap Ĺ inch plywood to it. The piece is then screwed down to the plywood using strategically placed counter sunk holes so the saw deck can slide over the screw heads if/when necessary. The rounded inside corners are drilled on the drill press and a larger hole is drilled through the aluminum and plywood for the saw blade. The plywood not only makes a secure platform for cutting without the aluminum bouncing around, it helps keep the saw blade cool and clear of aluminum build up. If you plan ahead a lot of times you will not even have to reposition the piece while cutting or use a clamping system for the final cuts.

    Simply clamping a piece of aluminum to a table top and letting the edge hang over and cutting usually does not end up with a good cut/outcome especially if the cuts are intricate and there are a lot of them. It is well worth the time to build a sacrificial cutting table and usually you can finish the cuts quicker with better results and less finishing time.

    I used 1 saw blade for the interior cuts of the 2 side plates and the blade is still sharp, a couple different grit carbide dremel bits that hardly ever dull and about 8 dremel sanding drums.

    You also have a big mess to clean up afterwards My wife is constantly reminding me about little shiny metal shavings that like to follow me upstairs and fall off me if places where she can see them

    Drill shavings from 1 side plate


    Cutouts


    Drill press grinding debris (cleaned up a few times prior to pic)
    No slipper/tall gearing/power = broken parts.

  40. #360
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    Got a picture/example of the cutting table? I'm better with pictures than words . Also what specific blade are you using? I'm considering making some braces for my baja 5t.

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