Hey guys. Some of you may have noticed that with the protrac arms, you have a little backwards and forwards play. Especially in the back with the suspension arms, and in the front with the fiberglass bar. And back and forth slop in the suspension (including pins) will cause you to veer quickly and unpredictably from one side to anouther. You will have a hard time tracking straight at all times and your truck will be unpredictable. Fixing any and all slop, will fix this and help you track straight.
Nice thing about this is what u need is there, and easy to fix if you have this issue.
You will just need 8 of these traxxas washers
Place the washer in the locations where the red arrows are pointing to. In the back, just use a flat head screw driver and push them in, and try to alighen them, and look into the hole where the suspension pin goes in until it is center and the pin can slide thru. On the back is also where I had the most front to back slop. This made it fit perfectly snug, and also not to tight while eliminating said slop. worked real nice
On the front, I placed them at differnt locations to also help Fiberglass tie bar slop. In the back, I placed one by the e-clip, slid it threw than one in between the arm, and the fiberglass bar so it was easy to clip the e-click back on and off. Simple and effective. Also pay attention to your pins on your castor blocks and see if they need attention.
This may very depending on which tranny case you have, and which bulkhead as well.
Some things are meant to have some floating room. I wouldn't try and remove to much of the slop. Or you may find you have to keep adding more spacers as things wear down.
Oderint Dum Metuant
no, not in this case. its not like a bridge where it needs to have temp adjusting room. Theres really no need for it, its not wear causing restrictive whats so ever. Its still just as free flowing and not giving it even the slightest restraint in the up and down manner. And definatly not as much as it had no. If it was tight with these washers, than ya. and it would wear away at the plastic inside a bit and creat a little indent, and you would have a stiffer suspension in all the wrong ways. But when going 65 mph, not many things need to be slopy and have floating room. A small amount of slop here, will multiply when by the time it reaches the wheel. If anything the opposite would be true. Bouncing around backwards and forwards would cause alot more wear and tear and possible damage than it being snugly, and "properly" fit on there. Besides. . .with those washers, it becomes the same way the stock arms, or RPM arms sit. AND EVERY other well built RC car/truck. Its not like overtightening the screw that attaches the castor blocks to the suspension arms where it cant flow easily, and wears on the castors alum or plastic. In this case, if anything its going to Prevent wear, Breakage from slop on a bounce from a landing. This ALSO makes the suspension arms sit just like "every" other well built RC out there, and bounce back and forth on the gearbox suspension pin screw. The suspension arm is meant to slide around the suspension pin, not move up and down it. Things meant to have floating room are things like plastic shafts, Sungear outdrives in the diff, CVD linkages, shock caps moving left and right, and maybe a few more I cant think of. Suspension arms need no "floating" room bouncing, sliding, and hitting the gearbox back and forth causing inaccuracy, and instability.
For Example: Eliminating front wheels from the left and right slop of the front drive shafts inside the bearing carreirs without restricting forward movement. My front wheels in no way move left and right, and do the traxxas factory click and slop if you move your front wheels to the side in left and right direction. Because of that, my front wheels spin precisly and do not wobble whats so ever. However, One slow spin and they will spin for a long amount of time like bearings should because they are free flowing. The goal is eliminating slop in the wrong driections while permoting correct flow
I have heard countless number of people who mention how their stampede will not track straight no matter what they seem to do, and how they set thier trim. My Pede tracks as if it on train tracks and runs straight as an arrow. My Pede will not deflect left or right more than 2 feet over the course of more than a hundered yards without any steering on a straight speed run if launced correctly. Not many Stampedes can do this. (can but are not adjusted to do so) Its just taking to time to eliminate "slop" and promote wanted freeflowing correct movement.
Last edited by AbSoLooT1; 04-02-2011 at 04:27 AM.
This diagram shows the goal of this adjustment. This eliminates forwards and backwards movements shown in red, and promotes precise and freeflowing standard movement shows by the green arrows.
Last edited by AbSoLooT1; 04-02-2011 at 04:28 AM.
Nice how to. Does it perform better?
If it ain't dirty get it dirty
My Protrac is the same way with stock components. I figured they made it this way to avoid binding. I think adding washers would cause it to bind at some point. Mine tracks straight also. Most of the tracking issue on the Pede is caused by the servo setup. The savers on the Pedes are more prone to wear vs. the Rusty. Perhaps an email to Proline is in order to find out the reason why it is like this.
Was an xl-5, now its vxl-ent!
My concern would be fine particles of sand getting between the washers and arms/bulkhead and wearing on the parts where the little gap would allow those particles to fall out or not get trapped at all. Either way I don't think it's gonna make a major difference in the end. These are toys and we bash on them for the most part so at any point or time something is gonna break or wear out. My Protrac kit is here and my new ST Racing lock nut pins are arriving today via. USPS so I'll be making the transition later today.
hehe.. rcecar. U stated that no gap would allow for dirt to get in, but a gap would allow for dirt to fall out. kinda of a contradiction my friend hehe.. maybe so, Mine had alot of slop and with the washers it feels like it "should" Maybe this is unique for myself in how sloppy it was, but with the washers it is much better. Memba, It feels like id did with the "stock" arms.. Still free and unrestricted movement, just no "slop" Plus to, mine turned out the way it should feel and has "no" binding whats so ever. So its completely freeflowing in terms on up and down movement and still feels nice and free flowing and unbound what so ever. Just in case, I will check it out. As u can see, its been dirty and Im still plannin a few more dirt rallys before I check it, and I will post pics up of how it looks inside after wards. but either way, if the slop is there. Give it a shot. takes a whole 3 secs to add em on, and they are easily removable. This is the same washers used by traxxas in between thier shocks and thier shock mounts and other places. If it was even the little bit, even slightly tight, and not free flowing at all, id agree with you guys. But I think where im struggeling to come across is that it is still ever free and not bound in any way shape or form. If i pick up the arm holding the chassis. (not mounted to carrier) itll fall just as free flowing. If that makes any sense. Its still completely free from any and all wear causing restrictions. thats what I mean. maybe i just need to do a video. lol.
ooo btw. On the front, I still get a tiny bit of that play as it is normally just not so much as the fiberglass tiebar bouncing around back and forth. I just checked it again, lol.
And memba. These are traxxas washers, used in other places just like this. I also used these in between my RPM wheelie bar mount, and my wheelie bar. The 4 screws it attaches to. Being it took me so long to build my pede cuz of budget and I wanted everything Just right, I spent tonz of time on trying differnt things, and seeing if there was "better" way for something. Many things of course didnt stay, but I tried differnt things, with differnt gaps and differnt tiny adjustments. This one im real sure about, ya guys should give it a shot and see if you like it. If you have the stock gearbox of course, itll be diff for sure with any alum brand as each will have there tiny differences. Even the same brand, one brand to anouther.
Last edited by AbSoLooT1; 04-02-2011 at 01:18 PM.
slop, and to track straight need precision. Thats all. Ill be the test subject and let ya guys know, ill also take it apart soon and snap some pics for ya guys. One things for sure though, the washer isnt squeezing on the plastic at all. its still "completely" freeflowing, all it did was losen the slop gap to where it doesnt bounce around on the pin left and right. didnt tighen it at all.
Last edited by AbSoLooT1; 04-02-2011 at 01:18 PM.
There is a bit of free play starting a the motor and working its way to the wheels. Removing it will cause increased wear. The small amount of back and forth movement found on the arms of every RC car is nothing to worry about unless its due to worn out pin holes. I think your mounts may have been worn down.
Oderint Dum Metuant
Well, I got all my stuff today and made the transition to the Protrac kit. Also got Integy Caster blocks (which they forgot to tap the bottom for the screw that holds the bearing carries on so I had to do that) which I got a deal on. I got the RPM front bearing carriers and RPM Slash front bumper. Also the ST Racing Lock Nut pin kit which is the bomb!! It's designed to bottom out the nut at just the right spot for proper tension on the arms. I had no slop issues with my Protrac arms at all so there must be slight variances from part to part.
This is all reassembled with my Proline Torque front wheels on the back and vice versa. This has the rear tires just slightly further out than the fronts. Soon I will have Mashers and probably some RPM front wheels all around.
I'm using for the moment the stock front shocks since one of my Integy's broke the top mounting boss off and they refuse to return my emails. I took the Integy body mount a buddy gave me and machined down the 2 stubs that the body sits on so it sits much lower on the truck now. I took this pic before cutting them down.
The RPM Slash 4x4 front bumper and Protrac arms.
Note the pins holding the arms on. The ST Racing is a must have kit for these IMO. Hardened steel with lock nuts on the opposite end means no pins backing out and no bending or at least reduced chance.
The body sits much lower now due to cutting down the Front mounts and lowering the rear mount. Body sits almost entirely level to the chassis too. The person who put the decal on the body from the factory needs glasses though. The front sticker is off to one side as can be plainly seen.
As you can see the body is just about perfectly level to the chassis and lower than original. I took about 3/4" off the front stubs with my lathe then drilled and retapped them.
Just a fuzzy pic of the Integy caster blocks and RPM front bearing carriers. And I also bought some Dubro Products body clip retainers so I don't lose or misplace them anymore.
I got it all aligned up and took it out for some test bashing and it tracks so incredibly straight now it's unreal. Also did a couple of 25' + jumps with it already and it handles like a dream. Can't wait to order my new wheels and tires shortly. I do have Dynamite blue aluminum shock bodies and caps coming. They were pretty cheap and will look and function better than the stock plastic until I eventually put most likely ProLine shocks on. The Integy shock will be taken off and kept for spares along with the stock ones. The only Integy part I will leave until they bend or break is the Caster Blocks. I also have an RPM adjustable front body mount coming and will replace the Integy one to keep it lighter. Last things I think I'll get will be an Alum. trans case and front bulkhead and maybe alum. skid plates. I'm also gonna fab up another battery hold down for the back of it as I use some foam right now between the ESC/Receiver mount and the battery.
Last edited by Rcecarbldr; 04-02-2011 at 06:28 PM.
on the reply to your first post, I stated how some things need to have play. Such as the sungears in the diff, leading to the outdrives, down the shafts, and out to the shafts connecting to the wheel. Your right and they do, and ya there is even some play in the motor like u said. Alittle bit of back and forth play. But talkn about suspension having the proper, and " improper" play. I first installed the protrac on my old gearbox. But but the end of the build I replaced everything on my pede except for the half shafts, and current shock bodies, Before I was finished, it went on a brand new gearbox. So its not the mounts cuz it went on two differnt ones, One of which is/was brand spankn new. The space im talking about, didnt exist with the stock arms. Only when I isntalled the protrac. Maybe il do a video expalining and showing what it was like, and how its like now so ya guys can see cuz I think im havin a hard time explaining what it turned out like. You guys are right that if its at all restrictive and squeezing in anyway, even the smallest bit its gonna cause wear and grinding away, but what im tryin to get across is that all the washers did was minimize the unneeded slop space and down to fractions of a mm while keeping things as freeflowing as they need to be to not cause rubbing, restriction, and/or wear. Your guys points are all correct, and I completly agree. What im sayn here is it isnt doing so those things were also number one in my mind when I did so in the first place too.
RceCar... BOO YAAA! awesome bro! with a blue STRC bulkhead its gonna look even better. Your truck looks great, Good job dude! Dont ya love the protrac. Im gonna join you and get those STRC pins myself to. Also, the RPM mount will lower your body even more, and itll be flush with the "bottom" of the chassis, and after I did it, my lady and I thought it looked even better. Like in the pic below> We have really close to the same style brotha, Our trucks look really close to one anouther, except for the color changes. You should dye your gearbox black for sure. Also, Looking at that pic underneath, it almost looks sealed in a way, or am I seeing things? Ive also noticed you have your protrac kit set-up perfectly with that they recommend as a starting point, except for your back camberlinks mounting to the rear shock towers. Those should also be in the middle points just like you have on the fronts. I do also like your rims and tires. Those look nice too. When u have the revolvers, and the mashers, our trucks will look even more alike except like opposite in colors. Wish u lived by me. haha, wait. Scratch that. Wish i lived by u in sunny florida. Stupid Utah winters.lol. Excellent bro. I like that the STRC pins also stop it from squeezing, and im already tired of the stock pins unscrewing themselfs. You should pick up a RPM wheelie bar mount to, its been great to me so far and no danger of it pulling out from underneath that seems to happen. oh, also. ya should post these pics to in my build thread. Show the similarity to our trucks and their shared rugged styles. Like your bumper alot to bro. Way cool man great job.
It's been beautiful outside for weeks now down here so I have all the time in the world to play with my Pede as long as I get work done and family time in.
I didn't seal the Trans but I did have it apart once when it sheared a pin so it may just be dirt along the seam from oils since I did have a shock blow fluid all over it once.
I drilled and screwed my wheelie bar to the skid plate with #4 Stainless sheet metal screws and it's been working great. One on each side.
It was your build that got me wanting the Protrac kit and matching color alum. parts. I was originally gonna go with the RPM arms and even though they are quality pieces, I like these better. Real beefy looking. I'm thinking of Revolver wheels but in Chrome to go with the Mashers. I'm also gonna get some quality Boca Bearings for it since I've already killed a few of the Traxxas Blue bearings. Gonna try and balance my new wheels and tires too for less stress on the bearings.
Crazy I remember the set-up sheet being the middle on that guy. Thats good though, Im sure the diff there is very small anyways. Heck ya, im the same way. I usually wait for the girly to go to get to bed and thats when my other gf gets tlc. lol. Heck ya man , glad to do so. When I glued my wheels to my tires, I very carefully eliminated the tiny little plastic and rubber molding residues so they were pefectly straight. The revolver wheels are like two differnt mold pieces and then they are joined together. At this joint, there is a time little plasitc bit that sticks up. On my mashers there were a few of the same thing, with both a took a good while and made sure the surfaces were perfectly smooth so that even alittle wedge of plastic didnt cause the tires to stick up in the slightest of ways. Just stuff like that will make it as precise as possible, and you know they will be wel built. I have yet to balance my wheels too, and do the whole putty thing to get em perfectly balanced, but even without the truck rides awesome. Just like this whole suspension thing, I guess I am paticular, and precise with the way I do my stuff to a point to where some call me the 4 letter "a" word that is synonymous with rear end. lol. But thats all part of the fun for me.
Thats gonna be awesome though bro, If u decide to go blue alum camber links ill help ya with which ones are needed with the protrac.
I imagine I will have to do the same and when I do im gonna go bocas to. I have some red rubber sealed dynamite bearings in my carreirs that are holding up real well though. The traxxas bearings u blew, were they beyond cleaning them and all? I got some of them in a parts lot, and all the traxxas ones I was able to get apart, clean with electronic cleaner, re oil them and they look and work like new again, and they were in rough shape with some rust on em and everything. Theyre were some all metal ones in the lot to in the same condition, and those were a gonner for the most part.
As for the revolver chrome wheels, Just in case, on my first cartwheel I scratched the lips on half my wheels. Either one u decide to go with will look great. Black to or chrome. The black will hold up alittle better of course and not have visible scratches from road wear. Nice thing though, If u went chrome. Later they were in rough shape and u wished/wanted to go to black, You couple easily strip them of the chrome, and very easily and inexpensivly dye them black. Theres that option to so u dont feel stuck with your decision.
I just got the front Protrac arms, and also the ST Racing hinge pin kit for the Slash 2wd (these are pretty awesome so far no doubt), with a REM front bulkhead and there is no extra slop at all on mine. I'm also using the tiebar, so I don't know if maybe that has taken some out or what. I would say there is just enough for the arms to move a little, but nothing to cause worry. I doubt enough to get a Teflon washer on each side of the bulkhead.
Now on the other end of the front arms, I did have to do a bit of filing to get the castor blocks to fit a little better. They were way to snug for my taste.
ya it seemed im unique with mine. lol. I still have alittle play with the two little washers up front. Works well for me though. I know what ya mean on the castor block side. It'll stay with enough play unless you tighten that screw pin all the way, which is what you are suppose to do of course.. So i tighten it, than loosn it like 1/32 of a turn and that works well for me. It moves freely then, the bit of filing isnt a bad idea at all. That would work well. Little tiny later for some room to freeflow. im gonna be getting the STRC lock pins and see hows it is from there.
On the front though, The arm wasnt movin as per the bulkhead, just the tie bar on the Eclip suspension pin. It stil has a tiny bit of play which is good with the two washers. Works nice though on ma-truck. Things are nice and tight but not sqeezing or anything like that at all.
From what Ive gathered in no exact science. To each thier own and do what seems to work best for your vehicle. This worked well for mine, yet not restrictive in the proper ways in any way.
Last edited by AbSoLooT1; 04-20-2011 at 07:08 PM.