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  1. #1
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    Question

    Hello everyone
    I do not own a spartan but I was wondering, if this is a electric model why there are "gas" tubes going all over it
    please enlighten me

  2. #2
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    The moter and esc is water cooled
    Those are water tubes


    Sent using lipo power
    Mountains cant stop me
    they have tried

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    Oh now it makes sense!
    thanks

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    Im running 2. 3S thunder power 65c 130c burst batts leopard 4082 1600kv and 180amp esc in my Spartan why when im done running the batts a extremely hot and have just a lil puff also running stock prop
    Last edited by Chevypower427572; 05-26-2013 at 09:52 PM.

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    Are you running stock ESC?
    Are those 5000mah batts?
    Are the motor and ESC running hot as well?

    If the LVC isn't cutting in when it should you may be over discharging the batteries.

    Also check for anything that might be causing excess drag on the drive line, i.e. condition of flex cable, strut within 2mm positive or negative of nuetral, etc.

    hog

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    i think the batteries get so hot is because they don't get any air moving across them.plus we or I almost always stay at WOT.i am trying to think of a way to make a plate or plates to lay in the battery tray and have water tubes running through them to keep the batteries a little cooler.

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    5300Mah batts and no its a 180amp esc and the motor and esc do not get hot and I have no excess drag
    Last edited by Chevypower427572; 05-27-2013 at 03:23 PM.

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    How hot? Temp?
    Watch this....

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    Ok batts were probably running 150 + degrees before..now I cut out the air inlets and outlets on lid of Spartan and now the batts r running arnd100 degrees worked good......now I need help on getting rid of the side to side wobble @ full throttle??? Any help

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    Did you say you put air inlets in the lid?
    Watch this....

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    Yes I cut out those air inlets and outlets on the lid

  12. #12
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    I can see where some air flow might help, but you should be able to run without batteries overheating sealed up tight.

    The problem with air vents, is now when you capsize, the boat will quickly fill with water and soak your electrical components. This can be recovered from without damage, most times, but the less soakings the components get, the better.

    Where do you have lvc set on your esc?

    Hog

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevypower427572 View Post
    now I need help on getting rid of the side to side wobble @ full throttle??? Any help
    The side to side wobble is called "chine walk" and is caused when the boat is on plane and very little hull in the water, one blade of the prop enters the water and the other exiting causing the hull to rock from side to side.

    Cure.... none... You can minimize and reduce chine walk with additional inner trim tabs, move batteries forward... and the list can go on....

    A lot can be discussed on the subject of chine walk, but what I have stated is a simple description and solution to your "wobble @ full throttle".

    Hope this helps some....
    "enjoy your ride"

    Dennis

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    i have seen videos on you tube were they move the strut up an 1/8th inch and one guy moved it to the right like 4 or 5mm and it looked like all the chine walk was gone and it stopped the torque roll too.i have not tried this myself so i cn not say for sure it helps.i added a second set of stock trim tabs then added 2 sets of these http://benchmarkrc.com/traxxas_spart...m_tab_set.html and they helped alot but i also run my batteries near the middle

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    Yea dont want to get everything wet but I didn't no what to do I blew up a 2s batts inside my boat and now my 3s are a lil puffed after run it did help to cut the vents

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    I have tried a lot to get rid of it and its still there

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    i have noticed if i move my batts all the way forwaed it does not chine walk at all but it also slows it down some too.but i am also not trying to set any speed records either.so you could try that or adjust your trim tabs down to help keep the bow down. i am trying to think of some way to make a set of aluminum plates for each battery and make it water cooled too.make a top and bottom plate and let the straps hold it in too.i just dont have any type of equipment to mill or make anything but i have a friend of a friend that does and when we get together i am going to pick his brain too.i don't like my batteries getting hot either but it's kinda that what has to happen for now
    Last edited by hopduperevo; 05-28-2013 at 03:41 PM.

  18. #18
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    I only know of two people that have relocated the strut as you have stated, MAMBA2200 being one and the other I don't remember. He did this over two years ago I believe.

    MAMBA2200 had great success in achieving 69+ mph in his Spartan and I have not seen another Spartan go as fast as his, stock or other wise. The Lord knows I've tried.......

    But in the video I saw of his best speed run there was not just one but several passes made with zero chine walk... So with that being said.... It is not and easy modification but it does seem to work very well.

    I'll see if I can find the video of the modification and his speed run and repost it.
    "enjoy your ride"

    Dennis

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    Ok thank you I will try that and I like those trim tabs hopduperevo I also run my batts in the middle and it chine walk bad

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    Nice a video would be great.....im just trying to smack 50+ mph I swear I bought a lemon of a Spartan

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    thanks chevy and no you didn't get a lemon mine was doing the same thing when i first got it put 4s in back and i was happy then went to 5 and 6s and here came the chine walk so at first i just moved my batts all the way forward so i could enjoy wot and not worry about the walking but since i added the other tabs i have been slowly moving the batts towards the back with 0 to only a tiny bit of chine walking.i put a straight edge on the bottom of the boat and set tabs to zero and it wanted to bounce up and down so the next time i went i used straight edge and set tabs so they just barley touched and thats where they have been for 3 runs now as i move batts towards the back.if you look on you tube thats where i found the videos of them fix.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBLrdgCdIuM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quy9dYAmMwY
    Last edited by hopduperevo; 05-28-2013 at 04:27 PM.

  22. #22
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    You didn't buy a lemon, LOL your boat just needs to be set up for the conditions and it more often than not requires a considerable amount of time in the process. Additional center trim tabs are almost a must.

    You are running a 1600 kv motor and the stock Castle Spartan is a 1800 kv motor, and that 200 rpm's at 22.2 volts is costing you 4,440 rpm and I'm sure that may be one of the reasons your not getting to 50 mph.

    I can and do 50 + all day long on 6s, x442 or Prather 215 and I have the version 1 hulls with v two electronics.... So don't give up too soon!!!!!
    Last edited by orca44; 05-28-2013 at 05:10 PM. Reason: content
    "enjoy your ride"

    Dennis

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    so the 1600 kv motor is not a good choice? i just bought the same set up.can i run the stock motor on the 180amp esc?i thought ti was supposed to make it faster not slower.

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    The 1600kv leopard motor is a fine choice for reliability and torque.

    I've been running one for two seasons going into my third.

    You loose some rpm with 1600 vs 1800, but, within reason you can compensate with a slightly higher pitch prop.

    The spartan is plenty fast with a 1600kv motor. It just depends what you want, for excellent speed and reliability the 1600 will serve you well, if you want bragging rights on being .01 mph faster than the last guy to post, then 1800 or higher is where you want to be.

    It's all kind of relevant on this boat, as you prop up, torque roll increases, as you increase kv of the motor, stress on the components increases, as does risk of component failure.

    It's about checks and balances, and dialling in your setup for acceptable performance.

    Hog

    Edit: correction 1800 or higher isn't necessarily "where you want to be", 35,000 - 40,000 rpm is generally considered the max desired for sport boating purposes. Once you go beyond that, you are entering straight line speed pass territory.

    1800kv on 6s nominal voltage is on the edge of 40,000 rpm.
    Last edited by hog; 05-28-2013 at 05:01 PM.

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    ok cool.i was going for more speed but not worried about setting any records and reliability is important too.i am going to be running mine with a prather 220 prop.now my question is, is the spartan faster with the 180ampesc/1600kv or the stock 120/1800kv

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    Im not given up so soon thank you for all yur help im gone keep working on it.....and the 1600kv motor I thought it brought the Spartan alive

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    glad to hear that and keep up the good work

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    Quote Originally Posted by hopduperevo View Post
    ok cool.i was going for more speed but not worried about setting any records and reliability is important too.i am going to be running mine with a prather 220 prop.now my question is, is the spartan faster with the 180ampesc/1600kv or the stock 120/1800kv
    All else being equal, an 1800kv motor will turn at higher rpm than a 1600kv motor, so, all things being equal, an 1800kv setup will be faster than a 1600kv setup. The ESC doesn't really factor in to top speed, provided it is adequately sized for the required amp draw of the setup.

    However, very seldom are all things equal.

    First: the kv rating of these brushless motors refers to the UNLOADED rpm of the motor per volt applied.
    So a 1600kv motor will turn 1600 rpm with 1 volt applied, 3200 rpm with 2 volts applied, 4800 with 3 volts, and so on.

    A lipo battery cell has approx. 3.0v discharged, and 4.2v fully charged, with a nominal, or average, voltage of 3.7v.
    When doing calculations you generally use the nominal voltage.

    So a 6s setup has a nominal voltage of 22.2 volts (6 cells x 3.7 volts)
    22.2v x 1600kv = 35520 rpm UNLOADED
    22.2v x 1800kv = 39960 rpm UNLOADED
    A difference of 4440 rpm, in theory, an 1800 kv motor will produce a higher top speed than a 1600kv motor turning an identical prop, and all other things being equal.

    Here is where the all things being equal comes into play.

    Your motor is, I assume, the leopard 4082 1600kv motor. The stock Spartan motor is a 3674 1800kv motor.
    The physical size of your motor can is 40mm diameter, 82mm long. The physical size of the stock motor can is 36mm diameter, 74mm long.
    Your larger motor has more torque than the stock motor. (There are other factors like number of windings, and winding type, etc etc, that factor in, but for sake of discussion, bigger motor = more torque)

    Note that I emphasized UNLOADED rpm in my calculations above. The moment you install a prop and put the boat in the water you are working with UNDER LOAD rpm. A motor with more torque will loose less rpm under load than a motor with less torque. So in real world application the rpm difference between your 1600kv motor, and the stock 1800kv motor will be less than the calculated 4400rpm difference. So you "gain back" some of the rpm difference because under load, your higher torque motor will loose less rpm.

    Also, your higher torque motor will be better suited to running larger diameter and higher pitch props, which can gain back, and exceed any loss you experience due to the lower rpm of the 1600kv vs 1800kv. Remember though that as you increase prop size and pitch, you increase prop torque and torque roll, which need to be compensated for by trimming your boat. "All things are seldom equal"

    Still running with the "all things are never equal" theme. Battery weight, battery placement, strut angle, trim tabs, prop torque, chine walk, etc etc etc all play into the performance of the boat. The boat that is best dialed in will make the most of the performance it has to offer.

    To recap, two completely identical boats, properly trimmed out, same prop, one 1600kv, and one 1800kv, the 1800kv setup will have a higher top end speed on a straight out speed run.

    In reality, when racing another boat on a circuit course, the overall setup and trimming of the boat, combined with best skippering skills will win races, not necessarily the highest top end speed.

    Hog

    Note: if I have over simplified my explanation based on your experience, I apologize, certainly no insult intended. I just wanted the information to be of value to our less experienced members as well.

    PS I run the P220 with my 1600kv setup and it has proven a good combination.
    Last edited by hog; 05-29-2013 at 02:11 PM.

  29. #29
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    The knowledge on this forum is A+ ! Thanks hog for more great insight.
    Watch this....

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    yes thank you very much hog.and i am one of the less experienced member and that was very informative for me

  31. #31
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    As am I, and appreciate all the helpful knowledge that you guys are so willing to share. Thank you all, very much.
    Watch this....

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    Glad you found it useful. That is why we are here, sharing our experiences to enhance the enjoyment of the sport for others.
    Hog

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    Ok guys im running the 4082 1600kv with sea king 180 amp and I just bought the octura m445 prop I get up on plan and when I go to juice on it it shuts me down 50% and put me in limp mode and if I keep running it shut me down completely its obviously the prop is there changes I can make to run thus prop @ 100% are whats the deal

  34. #34
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    is this the first run with this esc/motor combo?

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    No it does alright with the stock prop for Spartan.

  36. #36
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    The m445 will put some additional load/current draw on your batteries and from the past experiences you have had with your batteries, I would venture to say you have a problem with one or both of the batteries not being able to deliver the amount of current needed.
    If you have a known good set of batteries, try using them, or go back to the other prop you were using with that same set of batteries that failed to perform with the m445.

    After I posted I see you did test with the stock prop (plastic?). Was that before or after using the m445?
    Last edited by orca44; 06-01-2013 at 12:23 PM. Reason: added content
    "enjoy your ride"

    Dennis

  37. #37
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    Iv always ran the plastic stock Spartan prop just wanted alil more prop so I bought the m445 and that is what happand

  38. #38
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    But did you run the plastic prop after running the m445 prop, with the same set of batteries in question?
    "enjoy your ride"

    Dennis

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    Yes I just went and did that and it ran for a min r so and I was completely dead in the water...when I did retrieved my boat opened her up and I had a water line to esc was off then I pkug in and I got to quarter throttle and shut off agian

    Ok I just discovered that when I plug in and even if I just tap reverse on remote it shuts esc off must be a short so I program esc to forward only and it seems to be wrking fine......
    Last edited by cooleocool; 06-01-2013 at 06:58 PM. Reason: merge

  40. #40
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    Where is your lvc set at on your 180 lvc.

    My experience with this esc is the the lvc cuts in a bit early.

    I was having similar experience with one of my Spartans and found I had to lower the lvc setting.

    Drawing your lipo cells below 3.0v can damage them, and common practice is to set lvc at 3.2 or 3.4 volts to provide an "insurance" buffer to recent over discharge.

    I found with my 180 esc set at 3.4v i would still have 4.0v at rest voltage left in the batts at cutoff. After much experimentation I found I needed to lower my lvc to 3.0v. (In fact as low as 2.8)

    I must caution that it is important to lower the lvc one setting at a time, and confirm your battery voltage is 3.2 - 3.4 at rest voltage after lv cutoff. And that you have 10-20% capacity left in your batteries to avoid over discharge.

    I now time my runs (5-6 mins) rather than rely on the lvc.

    Hog

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