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  1. #1
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    Trencher tires gearing question...

    Quick question everyone... I'm new to this hobby... About 3 month ago I purchased the stampede 4x4 vxl (with a 5800 mah 2s lipo) and since then I have clocked in about 5 hours of total run time... I know it's not a lot... The truck looks new except for some scratches here and there and I also replaced some broken parts... I recently ordered 2 pairs of trencher tires mounted on desperado rims... I was looking through the community posts and this one in particular caught my attention... So it looks like I will be buying the 9 tooth pinion gear... So now... My question... Will the speed and acceleration be affected by changing from the stock 11 to the 9? If so is it a drastic change? Like I said I'm new to all this and I'm learning as I go and as the parts break... That's how I'm getting to know the truck... Any info will be appreciated...
    Last edited by Sinuhe_0123; 05-06-2013 at 10:22 PM.

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    Right now you are probably in the 25-30mph range and going to the 9 tooth and larger tires will put you around 22-27mph.

  3. #3
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    Alright thats what i thought... last question... so if i change to a 9 tooth pinion gear do i have to change the stock spur gear too or will the stock one work fine?

  4. #4
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    The stock should work fine. Another way to reduce gearing for larger tires, is to use a larger spur gear.
    The effect on the top speed changes according to the changes you make in the gearing.
    Going from a 11 to 9 pinion is 18% less, so your top speed will be 18% lower. For the spur gear it works opposite.
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  5. #5
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. O.G.'s Avatar
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    But taller tires raises the gearing, so an 11t pinion with stock tires may be equal to a 9t pinion on the tall Trenchers. That's why people tell you to gear down when going to a taller tire.

    But I don't know how it works out math-wise.
    My Black & Blue Rally is faster than your color...

  6. #6
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O.G. View Post
    But taller tires raises the gearing, so an 11t pinion with stock tires may be equal to a 9t pinion on the tall Trenchers. That's why people tell you to gear down when going to a taller tire.

    But I don't know how it works out math-wise.
    Taller tires do not change the gearing (which is influenced by pinion and spur tooth count), but they they change the rollout (which says something about how far your car will move with a turn of the motor shaft).

    Math-wise it's not too complex. Going from a 11 to a 9 tooth pinon, the car will move only 9/11 part (which is 82%) of the distance at the same motor rotation rpm.

    When you go from Talons to Trenchers, the diameter goes from 119mm to 124mm and will make your care move 124/119 (104%) part of the distance at the same rpm.

    So to change the pinion gear size when going from 2.8 Talons to 2.8 Trenchers, a 2 teeth difference on the pinion would make your car slower. Changing the spur from 54 to 56 would be enough compensation.
    Nobody is born with experience.

  7. #7
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    But you also gotta remember the Trenchers are slightly wider, meaning they are heavier and more difficult to turn. Just another reason to gear down!
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  8. #8
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    Trencher are wider, I don't know if they are more heavy than the Talons.
    Nobody is born with experience.

  9. #9
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    That is so true... i almost forgot about that... a bigger tire radius will make you go faster... lol i got pulled over one time because of that... i overtook a cop on the highwau going 60 mph according to my speedometer but i knew because i had larger tires than thebstock ones i was doing about 65 mph... so when the cop came over in acted like i didnt know about the tire part... lol i didnt even get a warning... he told me to go get the computer reprogrammed so that it would take the new tires amd correct the speed... so according to that the speed should not vary that much... the 9t will make my rc truck go slower but the bigger radius tires will make it travel more... so its a win win how i see it... speed is not affected and im saving myself from breaking the motor... thanks guys... very helpful...

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    So now you are telling me to keep the stock pinion and get the larger spur gear? That sounds good too... what would you do... chage the pinion or the spur gear? Remember that im learning as i go... thanks for the help...

  11. #11
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. O.G.'s Avatar
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    Because the pinion is easier to change on this truck, I'd go down 1 tooth on the pinion to see how you like it. If it makes too much of a difference, you can put the old one back on and change the spur.
    My Black & Blue Rally is faster than your color...

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinuhe_0123 View Post
    So now you are telling me to keep the stock pinion and get the larger spur gear? That sounds good too... what would you do... chage the pinion or the spur gear? Remember that im learning as i go... thanks for the help...
    Quote Originally Posted by O.G. View Post
    Because the pinion is easier to change on this truck, I'd go down 1 tooth on the pinion to see how you like it. If it makes too much of a difference, you can put the old one back on and change the spur.
    Yeah it is much easier to change the pinion than the spur... so i will do that... if i dont like it i will chage the spur gear and that way i learn how to do disassemble it too... thanks man...

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinuhe_0123 View Post
    So now you are telling me to keep the stock pinion and get the larger spur gear? That sounds good too... what would you do... chage the pinion or the spur gear? Remember that im learning as i go... thanks for the help...
    Quote Originally Posted by O.G. View Post
    Because the pinion is easier to change on this truck, I'd go down 1 tooth on the pinion to see how you like it. If it makes too much of a difference, you can put the old one back on and change the spur.
    Yeah it is much easier to change the pinion than the spur... so i will do that... if i dont like it i will chage the spur gear and that way i learn how to do disassemble it too... thanks man...

  14. #14
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. spenniepoos's Avatar
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    Its always good to have a few different tooth pinions a round for the seasons like in the winter i gear up a tooth or two because the cool air keep the motor and esc in the save zone......peace
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinuhe_0123 View Post
    So now you are telling me to keep the stock pinion and get the larger spur gear? That sounds good too... what would you do... chage the pinion or the spur gear? Remember that im learning as i go... thanks for the help...
    Quote Originally Posted by spenniepoos View Post
    Its always good to have a few different tooth pinions a round for the seasons like in the winter i gear up a tooth or two because the cool air keep the motor and esc in the save zone......peace
    Lol im from texas and where i live winters and summers are about the same... lol

  16. #16
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    Man you are lucky i hate the winter and its sick now the summer's here and i can go bashing when ever i want and stay out late without needing lights....peace
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  17. #17
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. O.G.'s Avatar
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    Well I live in Misery and its finally spring... again. I thought it was spring last month but it got into the low 40's for a week.
    My Black & Blue Rally is faster than your color...

  18. #18
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    So I got my trencher tires mounted on Desperado wheels and bought the 9t pinion gear... After installing I rolled my rc back and forth just to see everything lined up properly and all of a sudden I start hearing a clacking sound... I figured it was the screw hitting the spur gear but it wasn't... It looks like the spur and the pinion's teeth don't click like the are suppose to... I also noticed that the width of the pinion gear is lead than that of the spur great... Could that have anything to do with it? Any suggestions? I put back the stock pinion just to see if the nice would continue but it is smooth as it can be with the stock setup... The pinion is a 9t 32 pitch Robinson Racing... The sales person at my local hobby shop could find the Traxxas brand pinion so I got this one... Should I try to find the traxxas brand instead? Maybe that fixes the problem?

  19. #19
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    I have used Robinson pinions without a problem. Could it be that it is a mod1 pinion?
    Nobody is born with experience.

  20. #20
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. spenniepoos's Avatar
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    Yeah make sure you get a 32dp pinion or it will not mesh right with the spur gear man.....peace
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinuhe_0123 View Post
    Quick question everyone... I'm new to this hobby... About 3 month ago I purchased the stampede 4x4 vxl (with a 5800 mah 2s lipo) and since then I have clocked in about 5 hours of total run time... I know it's not a lot... The truck looks new except for some scratches here and there and I also replaced some broken parts... I recently ordered 2 pairs of trencher tires mounted on desperado rims... I was looking through the community posts and this one in particular caught my attention... So it looks like I will be buying the 9 tooth pinion gear... So now... My question... Will the speed and acceleration be affected by changing from the stock 11 to the 9? If so is it a drastic change? Like I said I'm new to all this and I'm learning as I go and as the parts break... That's how I'm getting to know the truck... Any info will be appreciated...
    I'm in this same boat - had to go to a 9t pinion after buying trenchers (2s, stock motor/esc) to keep temps down. You can notice the top end speed change (will be slower), but torque-wise I didn't notice a huge difference. It sucks, but worth it to keep temps down. That said, you should monitor temps on an 11t pinion after you put the new tires on - you might not need to gear down.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petertje60 View Post
    I have used Robinson pinions without a problem. Could it be that it is a mod1 pinion?
    "Mod 1"? Pardon my ignorance but what do you mean by "Mod 1"?

  23. #23
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    The mod (or pitch) is the physical size of the teeth. Mod 1 gears have a larger size tooth than a mod .8 (which is the same as 32pitch). At the same time the mod .8 is larger than a 48Pitch tooth.

    Typically mod 1 gears are used on larger nitro vehicles like Revo 3.3 or high powered electrics like XO-1. The mod .8 (32Pitch) gears are usually used on 1/10 4x4 applications like Stampede 4x4 or Slash 4x4. Then the smallest tooth size Traxxas uses is the 48Pitch gears used on 2wd Slash / Stampde and our 1/16 vehicles. Typically you do not see the pitch rating for a mod 1 gear or the mod rating for a 48Pitch gear. Its a bit odd.

    EZ breakdown:
    Mod 1 -largest teeth
    Mod .8 (32 pitch) - Medium size teeth.
    48pitch - Smallest teeth

    There are other sizes out there both bigger and smaller than those above, but they are far less common and not used by Traxxas.

  24. #24
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    Nobody is born with experience.

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  26. #26
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TireSlinger View Post
    Just as addition to your more than fine explanation
    Nobody is born with experience.

  27. #27
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    I so glad I read this tread. I just put Trencher's on my truck. I did not know that I need to change the gearing....
    I have not driven my truck with the new tires yet. So, If I understand correctly. The issue with the bigger tires is load, causing the motor to work harder and run hotter, Which equals death.
    Last edited by ramflames; 05-14-2013 at 08:58 PM.
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  28. #28
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ramflames View Post
    I so glad I read this tread. I just put Trencher's on my truck. I did not know that I need to change the gearing....
    I have not driven my truck with the new tires yet. So, If I understand correctly. The issue with the bigger tires is load, causing the motor to work harder and run hotter, Which equals death.
    Correct. You can prevent the last situation by either gear down or watch your temps closely (always do that) and stop or pause at the right moment.
    Nobody is born with experience.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petertje60 View Post
    Correct. You can prevent the last situation by either gear down or watch your temps closely (always do that) and stop or pause at the right moment.
    So I have a 56 tooth spur gear on hold for me at the LHS, I'll be picking it up on Friday. Till then I'll not drive my 4wd Pede and I'll drive my 2wd Pede instead.....
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  30. #30
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    You guys here in the Stampede forum are a little conservative!! I ran a 11/54 for a while, then a 11/53 with a HR Delrin spur for a while on my slash 4x4 using 2.8 Trenchers. And that was 3s lipo! I did watch temps, and it was usually less than 60 ambient!
    Since the temps have been rising, I now run a Hobbywing WP-SC8 combo with the 3400kv motor at 14/54 also with 3s on 2.8 trenchers. No temp problems!!

  31. #31
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Petertje60's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by briandee View Post
    You guys here in the Stampede forum are a little conservative!! I ran a 11/54 for a while, then a 11/53 with a HR Delrin spur for a while on my slash 4x4 using 2.8 Trenchers. And that was 3s lipo! I did watch temps, and it was usually less than 60 ambient!
    Since the temps have been rising, I now run a Hobbywing WP-SC8 combo with the 3400kv motor at 14/54 also with 3s on 2.8 trenchers. No temp problems!!
    That Hobbywing combo is more powerful than the VXL combo. I think you are talking about the 3400Kv 4-pole motor which is more efficient than the Velineon and suffers less from heat problems.
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by ramflames View Post
    So I have a 56 tooth spur gear on hold for me at the LHS, I'll be picking it up on Friday. Till then I'll not drive my 4wd Pede and I'll drive my 2wd Pede instead.....
    I'm not sure this will fit in the Stampede 4x4. The factory is a 54T and optional ones are listed as 50T and 52T. I've never tried it personally. Please let me know if it works.

  33. #33
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. spenniepoos's Avatar
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    Sometimes just going down a tooth or two can make the differance between it being in the safe zone or it going into melt down and the motors peter said are two completely different animals so the temps or gearing would never be the same as each other.....peace
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  34. #34
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    So after paying a visit to the 4 hobby stores in town I was not able to find the Traxxas 9 tooth pinion I was looking for (part: TRA6745) so I decided to order it online along with some other goodies... It will be until sometime next week when everything comes in... So far my stampede is just sitting there... No going to risk running it with the trencher tires and the stock pinion... So I can wait since I'm not in a hurry... I did a few upgrades here and there but that's a whole different story... Will be adding a few photos next week after installing the parts I ordered so that everyone can see my stampede while it is still nice and clean... Before I start trashing it lol anyway thanks to everyone who contributed to this post and I'm glad to see that this post helped out a few! Have a great day everyone!

  35. #35
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    I've been running trenchers with stock gearing for months now, with no problems, i use fans on motor (and now esc) and just give a short breather every now and again, when i remember! Mind you, weather has been cold for what seems like forever here in England.

  36. #36
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    The temps here have reached the 70's. I have a RF temp gun. So I'll watch the motor temps. I am ESC cooling , just a heat sink on the motor for now.
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  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by cossack4 View Post
    I've been running trenchers with stock gearing for months now, with no problems.
    +1 here. I use an ESC fan and just keep a close eye on the temps. I usually check it every time I flip over and have to put the truck back on it's wheels. If you drive like me then that happens often.

  38. #38
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. spenniepoos's Avatar
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    I ran my pede with trenchers for about a year before my motor melted using fans on esc,motor with 11-13t pinion but the uk does not get as hot as parts of the usa.......peace
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  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by TireSlinger View Post
    I'm not sure this will fit in the Stampede 4x4. The factory is a 54T and optional ones are listed as 50T and 52T. I've never tried it personally. Please let me know if it works.
    So I got the 56t spur gear on Friday. Installed it Friday night. I fits, BARELY! I ran the truck in grass, loose dirt and stones. I forgot to bring my temp gun, AUGH! Motor got so hot it burned my finger touching it. I was more mad at myself at that point for forgetting my temp gun. I'm assuming that it was well above 150+ degrees. On another note. I'm disapointed with the Trenchers. I have read here on the forum about how they balloon. HOLY CRAP. Balloon is an understatement. Now I'm considering removing the tires from the rims and Duct taping the insides. Does that work? How do I remove the tires from the rims without damaging either one? SO Disappointed. Plus the possibily of stripping the hexs. Why can't a Company make quality tires and rims with a 12mm hex. For the cost of Trenchers and Desperado's The quality should be held to a higher standard. Ok, I'm done venting. Hope I didn't anger anyone....
    Last edited by ramflames; 05-19-2013 at 07:27 PM. Reason: spelling
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  40. #40
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    you can boil the wheels and tires, that will make the ca glue very brittle and you can separate the tires from the wheels without damaging anything.

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