New(B) Summit owner say'n HI

[Joe Camel]

Just wanted to get the virgin post over and done with (be gentle please) and say hello and thanks to all of you here. Ive been lurking for a few weeks doing research but now that i have been through my first few sets of batteries in my new Summit I figured I better register and post.

so might as well start off with a question:

does water break-in go faster than dry break-in?

I pulled the motor and ran 2 sets of (stock) batteries through it @ very low RPM (used throttle trimmer to keep it @ LOW, steady RPM) but even after almost an hour of running the brushes are barley worn.
Not even close to worn past the " _/\_/\_ " (humps).
Will repeating this in water (distilled) help speed up the process?

the wife and I and our 5 Y/O couldn't wait any longer to see the Summit in action so I've already run it around the back yard (about 2/3 acre in back) WOT @ times, on the stock batteries (will get the 25C / 5000 LiPo's going this weekend)

I'm a tinkerer @ heart, i used to be very into computer benchmarking and overclocking; dry-ice and liquid nitrogen, so i have a feeling it wont be long before i'll be modd'n this thing.

[Mayberry Kid]

Welcome to the group. Lots of info and help here

I broke my 775 in according to the manual. Appears to be just fine. It's hard to stay away from full throttle at times, but I don't think the occasional burst will be too bad on it. There are pros and cons to water break-in depending on who you speak to. Personally, I don't think water break-in is any faster per se, but it's consistent and complete when your finished. The opinions are that it floats contaminants away from the brush contact area, keeps the armature cool, and also keeps arcing to a minimum. It also avoids the full throttle temptation

I broke-in my Dewalt motor (yes I'm a tinkerer too) using the water method and it's just fine.

Enjoy and play, post pics and vids. They're a lot of fun. My 14 & 11 year-olds love to walk climb and bash

The Kid

[MAMBA2200]

welcome to the madness

[Joe Camel]

considering how slow it was going and the gradual increase in surface (contact) area I'm thinking a "full" break-in will take 4-6 hours of run time. is that a good guesstimate?

suppose the "humps" should be more like:

|\_/\_/|
|........|
|........|

but i think you got the idea

[noir 522]

Ahhh another "tinkering" mod-a-holic. My summit spends more time on my work bench incurring upgrades than in the dirt. My last summit build was taking too long to finish, so I purchased another (stock) summit to have fun with while my first summit was down for upgrades. Didn't last, within 1 week both summits were down receiving upgrades.

welcome to the forums.

Here a link for serious upgrade and custom fiddling ideas

http://traxxas.com/forums/showthread...g-thread/page3

[Mayberry Kid]

Once your brushes have started to conform to the armature it should be OK. What you do not want is a "flat" surface (the brush) trying to transfer a lot of current to a curved surface (the armature). As the brushes are "seated" to the armature, you begin to benefit from higher current transfer to the armature (due to greater contact area and lower resistance at the contact point). Arching should also reduce as the transition from one winding to the other is "smoother" so to speak.

Hope this helps.

BTW, what are you going to name your Summit?? Many folks here start threads on their "babies" and we get to watch them grow up, so to speak

The Kid

[Joe Camel]

many of the brushes Ive changed before, mostly in PorterCable routers, came pre curved to all but match the O.D. of the commutator. I was surprised @ the shape of the Titan's brushes. i assume it was "humped" to speed up the break-in period (shrug) but as it stands now, i have 3, mostly rounded, "fingers" of contact per brush. I'm sure I'll pull the motor sooner or later and give it a dunk.

I'll wait and see what the first major mod i end up doing B4 i name her ummmmm, it.
other than the all but mandatory light bar and double orange rear springs that ive already done.

pics will be up after the weekend. must remember to grab a board here @ work to make a nice little ramp, jumping the "turtle sand box" is getting old.

[Keila72]

I don't want to steer anyone wrong but Im a firm believer of breaking something in like you stole it. I build a lot of vehicle motors (1-1) for people and I also do a lot of performance mods on quads, motorcycles and street bikes. I went to school for all of this and it is NOT what I was tought but from my experience the motors last longer and perform better that way.
So my first stock out of the box motor lasted a month and I went out and got a new 775 and did not break it in properly, unless you call the mud, creek hill climbs, jumps, and a porcupine (LOL!!!!!!!) And full throttle for just about every set of batteries I threw in it.
I have had this motor In my sumit sense Feb and it has its been just about the only thing I haven't broke. Yet. I've been kinda wanting it to break so i can go dewalt but it just keeps going.

[reod12x2]

ya with the summit being my first rc the first run was full throttle in to a lazy boy lol boy did that chair move along with a fue words. then out side into mild snow at half to full throttle then run two i think i went slow but yas its been a year and more and the motor's going strong


and if the lipo's are standard size then they can be universial to 10th scale trucks to

nothing like a all in one battery

[Joe Camel]

who can stop and take pics when your having so much fun!?

i can now see just how addicting speed is with these things, but i think the Summit is plenty fast for the space i have to play in.
i ended up setting up a few jumps (ramps) in the backyard and set out to learn "control".

its too bad we havent had any good rain in the past month and 80% of the grass is dead as i have to worry about not turning my backyard into a bare dirt lot.
(yes, the thought of less grass to cut if i turned the back yard into a track did cross my mind.)

im just now (5 sets of batteries) starting to get a feel for how to adjust the trucks pitch in flight with the throttle and about how fast i can go and how steep i can make the ramps.

what i dont have a feel for is just how tough this thing is.

i started out very conservative in speed and height but have progressively gone faster, higher and further.
so let me ask a hypothetical here, lets say your driving YOUR Summit around and doing some ramp jumping, how high do you feel is safe if worst comes to worst and your going to land on the trucks NOSE (not wheels)? and then, how high would you feel "safe" jumping YOUR truck given your skill level?
this scenario is played out on flat land with grass (back yard).

[jamann]

The beginning of this vid should give you a idea on toughness
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mrpgk...e_gdata_player


Sent using magic and trickery
Ok it was Tapatalk

[krallopian]

+1 to a guy who bought the truck and ran it WOT immediately, and never looked back - and never had motor issues.

[Joe Camel]

well, i took the motor out for a quick cleaning and figured i'd shoot a pic of the brush...

you can really make out the "3 fingers" of contact


that look "ok"??

[ksb51rl]

The one weakness I have found with jumping a Summit is the toe links. If/when you land on on side the links will get slammed into the rod ends causing extreme toe out. This may not happen on a new vehicle but once parts wear a bit it may. Funny thing is that it does not seem to happen quite so much when crash-landing my E-Revo.

[Joe Camel]

been kicking the "Name my Summit" question around as i drive the truck.
i thought i had it narrowed down to two possible names.

DeWall-E (Dewalt motor should be here soon. 14.4V + 18T)
-or-
The ReInforcer (T Bone Racing skids/bumpers should be here soon too)

but then my wife and kid trumped me and came up with the perfect name: Flip

[stickychinsac]

lol leave it to the family, im guessing they are hinting towards your driving style. If thats the case mine would be find poison ivy truck.

[Keila72]

Lol. I guess mine would be porcupine.

[maxi single]

The one weakness I have found with jumping a Summit is the toe links. If/when you land on on side the links will get slammed into the rod ends causing extreme toe out. This may not happen on a new vehicle but once parts wear a bit it may. Funny thing is that it does not seem to happen quite so much when crash-landing my E-Revo.

That's a cool observation, my Summit have mystery developed toe out but never found the cause, now i will pay attention during cleanings.

Recently my front pillow balls on one side threaded out on their own by 2-3 mm while it's possible I tweaked them by accident the truck pulled to one side and I had to compensate via steering trim. The bad part was I didn't notice untill the dust covers finally ripped open and I could see the exposed pillow ball threads. Those dust covers have to go.

IMO the Summit's heavy weight puts a lot of strain on the linkages during impacts.

[Joe Camel]

yup, i've been practicing no wheelie bar wheel stands and the wife is trying to master (too) high speed turning; weight transfer and lateral G's just arn't her thing.
Thus Flip has been doing a fair amount of time on his side/back and in need of a flip (over).

all in all i have to say this is one of my better hobbies, considering the family time and exercise we are all getting.
though i could do without the 90+ temps and sunburn.

[Joe Camel]

guys, you didnt tell me I'd be needing a 2nd mortgage in a few months

LOL


but i wised up THIS time... (shhhh don't tell: buy USED )


WARNING do NOT charge LiPo packs in the corner of your living room!!






this is a full T-Bone Racing "armor kit"
the back bumper is about as big as the front but you cant really see it well

absolutely LOVE the front lower A arm skids!! the top squeezes in-between
the two "bars" effectively making it one solid part.

this thing feels like a tank and does add a bit of weight but i have a feeling

the Dewalt will be up to it.


which brings me to question 1:
the Kershaw Designs wiring off the motor is a single wire (yes, 2 total + and - )
should I: splice the two wires coming out of the ESC -or- only use 1 of the wires?







question #2...


this E-Revo brushless corners soooo much better than the Summit.

Ive adjusted the steering mechanically and within the transmitter settings (%)

to try to get the most physical turn out of the Summit as possible but to no avail.

is it the soft sidewall tires or





.

[Mayberry Kid]

+1 on hobbies with the kids RC's and bikes have been great for my family. I now need a rack mount to put my Summit on my bike

To your questions...

kershaw has probably done their homework and placed large enough wires on the Dewalt. Remember they sell a dual Dewalt setup too. That's probably the reason for just one pair of wires. By the same token, Traxxas did their homework too! The EVX2 can control dual motors in some of their other products. It's probably more cost effective (and efficient) to have one controller for multiple uses. The extra wires are a nice upgrade for our Summits and I am sure they benefit the machine.

Mini electrical lesson starts here, sorry if this is redundant :

Heat is caused by current flow. You will get excess heat where there is a restriction to current flow, such as a smaller wire or a poor connection (solder or plug). Just as a chain is only as strong as its weakest link, current flow will only be as great as its biggest restriction. We as RC'ers want as much current to reach that motor as we can get. That's why we use large gauge fine stranded wire and gold connectors(gold is the best conductor with lowest contact resistance).

I would start by using just one wire each (+ & -). If your wires get overly warm after a run, then I would think about splicing the ESC wires or adding another + & - to the Dewalt motor.

If the individual wires from the ESC are much smaller that the Dewalt wires, then go ahead and splice them together. If splicing the wires together from the ESC makes their combined diameter much greater than the wires from the Dewalt, then I would add another + & - to the Dewalt and use all four wires.

As far as question two, tires tires tires! Remember the design of the Summit, flexible sidewalls are what makes the Canyons one of the best crawling/climbing tires out there. That same flex dooms us when it comes to sharp turns at much higher speeds. I'm still on the fence in my search for a more basher friendly tire for my son knowing full well that my climbing crawling will suffer somewhat.

Just my humble opinions,

The Kid

[Joe Camel]

whelp, there she is.
the wires off the motor are the same gauge as the wires out of the ESC






this motor mount raises the motor (and thus center of gravity) "quite" a bit VS. the stock mounting
and there is no cover over the gears






I'm going to mod a large fender washer and kill two issues with one mod.

the tabs on the front of the motor dont allow for a very "true" mount and even pushing the pinion as far back as possible, it still only engages 2/3 of the spur gear

I'll file 4 relief sections in the washer for the tabs (think I saw 87 GN do this) and hopefully pull the motor back just enough to get "full" engagement between the gears.
that should also help with contact area and thus heat transfer out of the motor and into the mount

[Joe Camel]

ahhh, much better!

[Mayberry Kid]

Shweet!,

I had a similar alignment issue when I installed my Dewalt with a modified stock motor mount.

The Kid

[ksb51rl]

Just a question: why did you go with the KD mount? It is not necessary for one Dewalt motor. IDK - it seems to cause more problems than it solves.

[Joe Camel]

a fair question.

this hobby is still a little new to me and i wasn't too sure about doing the wiring on the motor, so I headed over to KD for a wired motor. Once i was there i saw the heat sink and @ that point it was just "one more click" to get the mount too.

not to make excuses but i didn't know/think of the CG or gear cover issues at the time.

dont worry, it wont be long before i bring out the power tools and start moddn' my own parts


EDIT:
LOTS of problems signing on here and sometimes even just getting to the Traxxas sight(s)

[jamann]

Yes logging in issues here as well.
I am not a fan of the kd mount makes it a pain to get the motor out for maintainence. My buddy has one on his hate it....lol


Sent using lipo power

[Joe Camel]

live and learn i guess



i havent been able to even get the traxxas[dot]com home page to load since that last post.

figured i'd post while i can, not that i have anything new to say

[ksb51rl]

Look at it this way: if you ever want to add another Dewalt, you are set!

[Joe Camel]

Look at it this way: if you ever want to add another Dewalt, you are set!

exactly!

when is having too many Lego bricks to play and build with been a problem?


could the EVX2 even survive 2x Dewalts?
it gets plenty hot** on just one.

i must admit, having an unused set of motor leads is almost too tempting NOT to add a second
[mental note: winter set-up: twin motor?]

and the battery life (run time) must be great on twin-motor setups


i assume "pairing" the stock Titan with this Dewalt would be bad in any number of ways




** I'll breakout the temp gun next time

[Mayberry Kid]

Do not pair mismatched motors, ever!

The Kid

[ksb51rl]

Do not pair mismatched motors, ever!

The Kid

Why not? The won't be mismatched for long! (One or both will DIE.)

@one EVX-2 & two Dewalts: I wouldn't do it, but it has been done.