XO1 battery question

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-01-2012 07:18 PM

I'm trying to go as fast as I possibly can with the stock motor and electronics before I switch to 8s. (assuming I have anything left) Would a set of Maxamp 100c batteries give this thing any more power up top under a heavy load? If so, any idea how much? I want to see what this thing will do on 6s and if better batteries will help, I would like to try them.

I've made some HUGE gains in modding the car to make it more driveable and I think I should be able to find the limits of this thing pretty soon. Driveablity is the key. If you can't drive it, it will never be fast.

**Strykeviper** · 07-01-2012 07:33 PM

I would do some research before you fork out the money for maxamp batteries.

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**Jakey** · 07-01-2012 07:39 PM

There is no such thing as honest, 100C RC LiPo battery packs.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-01-2012 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by Jakey

There is no such thing as honest, 100C RC LiPo battery packs.

Ok, but the Traxxas ones are only rated at 25. Surely the 9000 mah 100c ones would be better?

**Jakey** · 07-01-2012 08:29 PM

Originally Posted by TheStenchOfSpeed

Ok, but the Traxxas ones are only rated at 25. Surely the 9000 mah 100c ones would be better?

People have reported the Traxxas packs perform like an honest 25C, however it is well known on several RC forums the C rating of "those" packs are grossly exaggerated. In fact I would wager the Traxxas 25C packs will out perform the labeled 100C packs.

**AnthonyV** · 07-01-2012 09:27 PM

What top speed have you been able to hit sofar with the stock Traxxas 25c's? I have been thinking about going with a much higher rated C lipo as well.

Here is what I have found out sofar... MaxAmps are nice batteries but (as stated) are highly over-rated from the factory. They are also very expensive. I talked to Castle Creations and they mentioned running a Thunder Power battery on my Spartan boat (boats require higher C ratings than our cars do). They said that those batteries are the best bet for actual high C ratings. If you search around forums, you'll see that guys are very happy with the Thunder Power lipo's. The highest rating for a 3s is 65c... but they perform closely to a 65c.

I have ran 2 sets of batteries in my XO1: Traxxas 25c and T ****'s 65c. You'll see a lot of conflicting reviews with the nanos... but they work great and my XO1 runs faster with the TN 65c's than the Traxxas 25c's. You'll see guys say that over time the C rating on the TN's will decrease... I've had about 10 cycles in them and they continue to work quite well. I was talking to Castle about the TN's and they said they over-rate their lipo's and are in actuality about 50-75% of what they claim the C rating is. So I'm guessing the TN's are around a 40-45C.

Another company that has great feedback is Ace Gens. Supposedly there's a local guy that runs 120c maxamps lipo's in his xo1 and hit 116mph. I haven't seen it run in person and it was supposedly clocked with a radar gun. But if you don't know how to use a radar gun it's easy to get skewed results but it's not completely unbelievable. Just based on the research I've done I'm led to believe the ThunderPower's are going to be a faster set-up than the MaxAmps. I just don't know that many people that can justify spending $300+ to only go a few MPH faster. I would really like to see some real world comparisons with these lipo's. If you could consistently gain 10-15+mph on runs (all things held equal) going from a Traxxas 25c to the ThunderPower/MaxAmps lip then I would probably fork out the money. But it's difficult enough to hit 100mph in this car yet alone finding an area to do so.

I was thinking about purchasing an ESR meter to actually test out lipo C ratings:
http://www.f3aunlimited.com/webstore...roducts_id=572

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...ight=esr+meter

**Gene C** · 07-02-2012 12:08 AM

The 8400mah lipos from traxxas are no joke...have been running those on the XO-1 that did 105 out at the cardinals stadium a few months back. The 8400s will do way better than the 5000s that came with it.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-02-2012 07:00 AM

Originally Posted by AnthonyV

What top speed have you been able to hit sofar with the stock Traxxas 25c's? I have been thinking about going with a much higher rated C lipo as well.

Here is what I have found out sofar... MaxAmps are nice batteries but (as stated) are highly over-rated from the factory. They are also very expensive. I talked to Castle Creations and they mentioned running a Thunder Power battery on my Spartan boat (boats require higher C ratings than our cars do). They said that those batteries are the best bet for actual high C ratings. If you search around forums, you'll see that guys are very happy with the Thunder Power lipo's. The highest rating for a 3s is 65c... but they perform closely to a 65c.

I have ran 2 sets of batteries in my XO1: Traxxas 25c and T ****'s 65c. You'll see a lot of conflicting reviews with the nanos... but they work great and my XO1 runs faster with the TN 65c's than the Traxxas 25c's. You'll see guys say that over time the C rating on the TN's will decrease... I've had about 10 cycles in them and they continue to work quite well. I was talking to Castle about the TN's and they said they over-rate their lipo's and are in actuality about 50-75% of what they claim the C rating is. So I'm guessing the TN's are around a 40-45C.

Another company that has great feedback is Ace Gens. Supposedly there's a local guy that runs 120c maxamps lipo's in his xo1 and hit 116mph. I haven't seen it run in person and it was supposedly clocked with a radar gun. But if you don't know how to use a radar gun it's easy to get skewed results but it's not completely unbelievable. Just based on the research I've done I'm led to believe the ThunderPower's are going to be a faster set-up than the MaxAmps. I just don't know that many people that can justify spending $300+ to only go a few MPH faster. I would really like to see some real world comparisons with these lipo's. If you could consistently gain 10-15+mph on runs (all things held equal) going from a Traxxas 25c to the ThunderPower/MaxAmps lip then I would probably fork out the money. But it's difficult enough to hit 100mph in this car yet alone finding an area to do so.

I was thinking about purchasing an ESR meter to actually test out lipo C ratings:
http://www.f3aunlimited.com/webstore...roducts_id=572

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...ight=esr+meter

I don't really know for sure how fast. I'm waiting for the traxxas gps sensor. When I first started out with this thing, I would get a lot of erroneous telemetry readings from wheel spin. It was easy with a crappy set up to spin the tires and show a big mph. Now that the car is a lot more sorted out, I have seen 104. I don't think the tires are slipping much now so that shouldn't be too far off. At those speeds the car is accelerating much slower of course. It will be interesting to finally get some gps data to compare too.

I was under the impression that the Maxamp batteries were good stuff. Now I don't know what to do, lol.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-02-2012 07:01 AM

Originally Posted by Gene C

The 8400mah lipos from traxxas are no joke...have been running those on the XO-1 that did 105 out at the cardinals stadium a few months back. The 8400s will do way better than the 5000s that came with it.

So you're saying the 8400s offer a noticeable power gain??

**AnthonyV** · 07-02-2012 08:44 AM

The 8400's may offer a slight bit more power than the 5000's... they will definitely offer a higher amp supply. The XO1 motor requires at least 125 amps if memory serves correct. As stated before, Traxxas is a true 25c battery so you're getting the 125 amps (provided your battery is in good condition).

(8400 x 25c) / 1000 = 210 amps

(5000 x 25c) / 1000 = 125 amps

mAh rating is more related to 'fuel tank size' rather than 'power.' mAh is going to give you a much longer run time whereas C (battery discharge rating) rating is going to give you more power. The higher C rating your battery the more current you can draw from your battery. This results in more power. I'll be honest... you sound like me... you want more power... and the 8400's are not going to cut it.

The 9000mAh 100C MaxAmps is a big battery and will last about 2x as long as the stock lipo's. It's also just shy of $400 bucks. If you want to take advantage of the 5c charge rating you'll need a better charger (if you don't already have one). One thing I don't understand about MaxAmps is their "C" Rating (they rate them for a constant C rating). I don't know how 'constant c raing' compares to Max cont. discharge value or the Max burst discharge value. For example, traxxas is a 25c/50c battery whereas MaxAmps just rates it at 100c (constant C value). If that 100c is closer to the max burst discharge value, that mean's its like a 50c/100c battery. If it's closer to the max cont. discharge then it's like a 100c/200c. If you just want peak power, the 120c 5450 maxamps are going to be better than the 100c 9000's. To keep it simple, look at the C rating as peak power... and the mAh as fuel tank size.

I think the price of the MaxAmps lipo's scares people away from running them. Even if they are over rated, I guarantee you that you'll get higher top Speeds with the MaxAmps than the Traxxas 25c 8400's. As far as what's going to be faster, according to reviews I will say the ThunderPower's seem to have better reviews and are not over-rated as the maxamps are though. Castle Creations highly recommends them. They also go for just under $300 bucks for the Pro's (http://www.thunderpowerrc.com/G6ProR...oBatteries.htm).

Trust me, the more research you do on trying to find the best battery out there the more confused you'll end up making yourself. Different manufacturers do different tests to come up with C ratings... then you've got all the forum guys who chime in with this and that. So in the end the only real way to know which battery is the best is to test each battery on the same set-up (or purchase the ESR kit). Not everybody wants to drop $1,000 to test out several batteries though.

For me, it's just hard to drop $300-400 bucks for 2 batteries that you don't even know what kind of top speeds you'll end up with. That and the more powerful of a battery you have the more torque steer you're going to end up with. If you're pulling 104mph on the Telemetry I believe you are in the 85mph-91mph zone easily. I spent just over $100 bucks for my ****'s and I hit 98 mph easily last weekend. It was a perfect run... but I hit the brakes too darn early. They have much more power than the 25c Traxxas batteries. I've been super close to purchasing the ThunderPower's and the MaxAmps... but then I end up taking the XO1 out and realize how the real world environments make it difficult to control this car and I say screw it and just end up sticking to my current lipo's. I'd love to hit 110mph but doing so on a narrow 2 lane road requires the perfect weather conditions and launch. In my opinion, if you want to max the XO1 easy then you're going to do so easier with a larger runway than with a larger battery. It seems that majority of guys that have broken the 100mph marker (GPS values not telemetry) have done so on area's that are 2.5 lanes or wider. Give me access to an airport and I guarantee you I can clock 105-110mph with my current set-up.

I really hand it to Car and Driver when they said the following quote: "Like the Veyron, the XO-1 is an expensive, high-tech conversation starter offering performance nearly impossible to exploit without access to a private runway."

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-02-2012 11:03 AM

If this thing is only doing 91, there is no way it will ever hit 100. I'm hammered down for a considerable amount of time.

I guess I'm gonna have to get a set of the maxamps and just see how they do. Either way I would get a bunch of run time if I ever do any more parking lot bashing.

**AnthonyV** · 07-02-2012 11:09 AM

You may be doing closer to 100mph if you can stay on the throttle for a decent amount of time. I know on my car for example I can hit 100+ on the telemetry with no problems (stock slicks or foams). My GPS however typically reads at least 10 mph off from the Telemetry settings though. My buddy also did some runs with his XO1 and he was clocking 93mph on the telemetry but the GPS only showed 78mph. The telemetry is a nice option... but its not accurate. Have you taken any live datalog recordings? That will help you know if you're getting any sort of wheel spin at full throttle.

You must have a nice stretch of road to be able to keep the throttle hammered down for a while. I can really only keep the full throttle applied for maybe 1-2 seconds before I have to hit the brakes.

Please let us know how you like the MaxAmps lipo's. If you feel brave... download a GPS app on your phone and strap it to the rear mount like I do, haha.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-02-2012 12:38 PM

What do you mean by live data recordings? I use the telemetry but thats it. I wasn't aware the Mamba Monster data logged.

**AnthonyV** · 07-02-2012 01:28 PM

Go to the dashboard screen. Touch the screen, then in the bottom right hand corner 2 buttons will pop up. Click record and it will datalog the dashboard screen. After you run it, touch the screen and click stop (bottom right corner). It will ask you to save the file then you can view the replay by going into one of the folders (I forget which one). If you see the RPM's/MPH increase fluctuate rapidly that's a good indication you're getting wheel spin.

But still... I have yet to see the telemetry give a 100% accurate reading. If you can clock above 100mph on the telemetry then you're doing pretty good in my opinion. It's not as easy to hit 100mph with this car as you have found out. That's why only a handful of people have been able to pull it off so far successfully on the street. Clocking 100+mph on a prepped track would be a piece of cake compared to the guys who can clock 100+ on the street as far as I'm concerned.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-02-2012 02:00 PM

Yeah, I'm already datalogging that way. It's pretty handy for analyzing the car. There is an option to "email csv file". Have any idea what that is for? I tried it and the file was unusable as far as I could tell.

**AnthonyV** · 07-02-2012 04:54 PM

Comma Separated Value... if it's anything like tuning software, it will be a text/excel file that has numerical values plotted in tables. I only use my iPod Touch for my Traxxas... so I never got around to setting up an email account on it.

I'm guessing it will look something like this:

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-03-2012 10:21 AM

I'm starting to think my stock batteries might be about used up anyhow. Too many crashes, and charge cycles. Yesterday I only got 4 100mph passes and then the car would only hit 100 if the tires were in the air.

**Gene C** · 07-03-2012 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by TheStenchOfSpeed

So you're saying the 8400s offer a noticeable power gain??

Absolutely, without a doubt. Cooler motor temps. It's not just about the longer runtimes either.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-03-2012 10:53 AM

Originally Posted by AnthonyV

Comma Separated Value... if it's anything like tuning software, it will be a text/excel file that has numerical values plotted in tables. I only use my iPod Touch for my Traxxas... so I never got around to setting up an email account on it.

I'm guessing it will look something like this:

Yeah, thats what I gather. I don't know why you would ever want to email that to anybody.......and I no longer think Traxxas reads any of this stuff so we'll probably never know.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-03-2012 10:54 AM

.Double Post

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-03-2012 10:55 AM

Originally Posted by Gene C

Absolutely, without a doubt. Cooler motor temps. It's not just about the longer runtimes either.

Wow, I wasn't aware of that.

**Gene C** · 07-03-2012 11:14 AM

More juice, less stress on motor and esc. The extra weight on the car helps keep it down too. Probably why I've never seen the nose lift up on this thing and sprout wings like an airplane.

**AnthonyV** · 07-03-2012 11:18 AM

The CSV file would be helpful when programming the ESC. You've got results right in front of you without having to go back and watching the video over and over. But they really need some more options to record though if you want to really fine tune the esc.

You also got more weight to worry about but the 8400's are going to be better than the stock 5000's. If you want more power I would recommend the ThunderPower 5300 65c Pro Racer's. The hard packs (pro race) are actually a better fit than the soft packs (pro power). However, the Pro Powers go up to 7700mAh.

I may be testing a set out this weekend... I'll make sure to respond with results. I almost bought a new set last night... then I backed out at the last minute, lol.

**AnthonyV** · 07-03-2012 10:54 PM

I went to the LHS today to pick up some A-Arms... met a local guy that had these for sale... and now look what's in my XO1, lol. They don't fit (too long)... but I'll figure out how to secure them better.

If everything goes as planned, I'll be testing the MaxAmps 6000mAh 100C vs the ThunderPower 5000mAh 65C's on Sunday afternoon.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-04-2012 06:49 AM

Cool, let us know how it turns out.

**AnthonyV** · 07-05-2012 04:51 PM

Well I couldn't wait until Sunday to run the new lipo's so I decided to run them on a 370ft straight away where I live at. The MaxAmps 100c's were stored at 11.4v and the Traxxas 25c's were at roughly 11.5v.

Long story short, the MaxAmps blew the Traxxas ones out of the water. Even compared to my ****'s they are much more responsive... especially at launch. For the first time I actually spun my back end out on the foams going in excess of 50mph. I had to stop with the MaxAmps roughly 35ft shorter so that I didn't smack into a curb at the end of the road.

Results (GPS Verified):
1) 50MPH Traxxas 25C - 335ft (6 runs total w/ GPS)
2) 62MPH MaxAmps 100c - 300ft (2 runs total w/ GPS)

I will be turning my punch control down with the MaxAmps when I go out over the weekend for the 100mph runs. These things weren't even at full charge and they were breaking the back end loose. For further comparison, I see roughly a 6-8mph top end difference when I'm running my 65c ****'s at speeds over 70-90mph at distances over 900ft. I'm only going 1/3 of the distance and already picking up 12mph in a shorter length. I'm pretty impressed with these lipo's regardless of all the bashing you hear about them on the interwebs. Hopefully I'll be able to try the ThunderPowers out as well.

**ddaniels** · 07-05-2012 08:48 PM

anthonyv could you post pics on how I got.those large patterned installed in your xo1? I have a hard time squeezing my **** 35c bats in there

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**AnthonyV** · 07-05-2012 08:52 PM

Sure, Give me the dimensions of your nanos according to hk's dimensions. I've got their 65c 5000s as well.

**ddaniels** · 07-06-2012 06:54 AM

i dont believe HK dimensions are correct on there website, did you have to take a dremel to the battery trays to get the 65C packs to fit?

**AnthonyV** · 07-06-2012 12:30 PM

My dimensions are as follows (for your comparison): 152L x 49H x 28W mm

I took a dremel to the rear battery tray so that the wires could exit. I can actually get them to fit without any further modifications but it is a VERY tight fit. I removed the battery retainers (2 screws to chassis) and planed them down on the inside a few mm. I then used a dremel to remove a bit more plastic from the center carrier bushing (plastic) where the batteries touched when installing. I didn't need to do this... but it just makes it easier to install/remove them and doesn't cause any wear on the outside of the packs.

To fit my MaxAmps I simply used the 6427x (battery hold down retainer tall) and 6426x (battery hold downs tall) and layed the battery on the ends of the battery tray. I'm using a foam spacer in the middle and everything just snaps into place. It holds the MaxAmps well... but I'm going to add additional sides just to give it a little further protection in the event of a high speed wipe out/flip.

**ddaniels** · 07-06-2012 12:51 PM

thanks anthony

**X2guy** · 07-07-2012 07:18 AM

Cant wait to see how thes batteries perform at higher speeds. My e revo should be here any day now and it will be getting the XO-1 batteries. Perfect excuse for a new set.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-08-2012 04:48 PM

Any high speed results with the Maxamps?

**AnthonyV** · 07-08-2012 08:45 PM

I do and I don't have results, lol.

First pull with the max amps I managed to clock the highest speed with the Telemetry that I have ever before. Example, my 98MPH GPS run was 114 mph for a split second and this one blew it out of the water. I managed to actually hold fully throttle down for at least 2-3 seconds as well today. We got the run on camera and the car was definitely faster than my 98 run a few weeks ago. We bring it back, pop the cover off, and I find out that I never turned the GPS on. Luckily on the next run I hit something in the road that took me into a ditch going 96mph. Broken RPM A arm = end of day.

According to my calculations, I should have clocked 103-104MPH had the GPS been on. But we'll never know now and it's all theoretical at this point.

Now, I have another issue at this time that I'll address in my BSR foam post.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-09-2012 06:55 AM

Ok. So I guess you definitely feel the Maxamps have more power?

**AnthonyV** · 07-09-2012 07:30 AM

I do feel that the MaxAmps have more power. I noticed yesterday that I was only clocking high 80s with my **** 65c's before I threw the MaxAmps in. These are the same lipo's that I was clocking 98mph with a few weeks ago. The datalog showed higher MPH's with the maxamps and I verified a 96mph run before hitting something in the road that threw me into a ditch. I still can't believe I didn't start the GPS program on my first run because I'm about 100% sure that I finally broke 100 mph.

I did do a few short runs compared to the traxxas lipo's as listed above and they blow them out of the water. I did a bit of calculations last night and the tire diameter at this point is going to result in top speeds roughly 10% lower. That sounds about right as a local guy here is claiming to have hit 116mph with the maxamps lipo's on his xo1. I'll probably end up running the car at another location sometime this week if you want to wait for further results.

As of right now, I still feel that the foams are a great addition to the car. But once worn down, you will suffer top end. They are a great option for drag racing as they will offer better traction and faster acceleration. The stock tires are heavier and will have slower acceleration and add more reciprocating mass.

**ddaniels** · 07-09-2012 08:54 AM

Just got the foams put on mine and I like them more than stock

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**AnthonyV** · 07-09-2012 11:19 AM

Don't get me wrong... I like the foams much more than stock. They are easier to control the vehicle and must faster off of the line. However, I believe once worn down they will start to decrease your top speeds. It's another catch 22 as everything else is in racing.

**TheStenchOfSpeed** · 07-09-2012 12:09 PM

Cool. I'm gonna order some Maxamps in the next few days and see how they do. Also working on a permanent fix for the slop that's in all my control arms. I'm not driving this thing another inch until that is gone. What's the point of having adjustable camber, caster, toe, etc if all your wheels flop around an eight of an inch, lol?

**AnthonyV** · 07-09-2012 12:35 PM

The RPM arms reduce the slop and seem to handle speeds in excess of 90mph quite well. However, they will break if you crash as I found out yesterday.

I had best results by using shims on the stock LCA's in order to reduce the slop. Try out the Traxxas 5x85.5mm teflon washers (Traxxas #1985).

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