Ultimate Off Road Jato Project

[jamesaclao]

What kind of brakes?

also, nice picture quality... Canon DSLR most likely, yes?

[jarod_rodriguez]

I think it is actually an Integy carbon fiber disc with brass shoes. Not a big fan of Integy, but the cost was reasonable and the parts seemed of high quality. Will see if it actually stops any better than stock.

I think most of the pics were taken on my wives Nikon D3100, but I think I used my Canon 20D as well. Which ever camera is close by I will use.

[jarod_rodriguez]

Quick question for the other Nitro experts. So the motor appears to be struggling to get fuel up from the tank. I tried to start it last night and I couldn't get it to turn over. The plug is good and it has new fuel line. The only thing I can think is that the THS tuned pipe has a leak even though it has a new inner and outer seals. I sealed the back plate on the motor, so I am sure that is nice and tight. Any other suggestions on what might cause it not to get fuel up through the line?

[jamesaclao]

I think it is actually an Integy carbon fiber disc with brass shoes. Not a big fan of Integy, but the cost was reasonable and the parts seemed of high quality. Will see if it actually stops any better than stock.

I think most of the pics were taken on my wives Nikon D3100, but I think I used my Canon 20D as well. Which ever camera is close by I will use.

[Mind_Reader7]

Quick question for the other Nitro experts. So the motor appears to be struggling to get fuel up from the tank. I tried to start it last night and I couldn't get it to turn over. The plug is good and it has new fuel line. The only thing I can think is that the THS tuned pipe has a leak even though it has a new inner and outer seals. I sealed the back plate on the motor, so I am sure that is nice and tight. Any other suggestions on what might cause it not to get fuel up through the line?

Take the fuel pipe from the exhaust. Blow on it. If there's a ton of resistance, then it's a problem with the carby. Probably a small piece of dirt blocking it.

Open up the HSN a lot, see what happens.

[tiralatete]

Hi,
it's nice while it's new and clean!
Where did you find the "metallic sheath" put on fuel lines?

[jarod_rodriguez]

Mindreader, you really read my mind. I was thinking about this last night when I was mentally walking through fuel flow etc... and it dawned on me that the carb has to be clogged. I will try what you say and see what I get. I have 2 or 3 other carbs lying around surely one of them is still good. This one was free with the motor, I bet there is some debris in there somewhere.

[jarod_rodriguez]

It is braided fuel line, comes as a package. You can Google it and find it around. Totally useless IMO, but looks cool. Only problem is you can't tell if the line is primed or not.

[Mind_Reader7]

Mindreader, you really read my mind. I was thinking about this last night when I was mentally walking through fuel flow etc... and it dawned on me that the carb has to be clogged. I will try what you say and see what I get. I have 2 or 3 other carbs lying around surely one of them is still good. This one was free with the motor, I bet there is some debris in there somewhere.

Don't bother switching carb. Has happened to me once or twice. Just open the HSN a ton, and blow on it, or completely clean the carb.

Also, your Jato still looks awesome!

[jarod_rodriguez]

Thanks Mindreader! Now if I can just get it running it will look even better.

Too late on the carb swap but I finally got it to crank. For some reason it would only crank after I installed an ez-start system. I have other issues at this point though. I took the ofna carb back off because it is too big with ez-start motor and was getting hung on return. So I put a cleaned up Traxxas 3.3 carb back on and it will crank with this one too, but will not stay running at all. I have reset the needles to factory default and adjusted idle to about 1mm. and it will not crank without me holding the truck off the ground and giving it a bit of throttle. Are the crank shafts different for pull start vs. ez-start? I know they are different for a bump box, but didn't think it would be different for pull vs. auto.

Thoughts on both issues????

I am stumped, the last time I couldn't get a motor to run/idle with factory settings was when the motor was just shot and had no pinch. THis motor seems to have good pinch, but just won't run unless you keep giving it gas. Beginning to see why this guy turned this motor in. Maybe it has a fracture in the block that i can't see or something.

Default needles are 4.5 HSN and 1.75 LSN right?

Thanks for helping guys, ready to get this thing running and have some fun off-road.

[koko_puff]

Hey!!! I recognize some of those parts!!!!

[Jersey Jato]

Check your clutch spring

[jarod_rodriguez]

Hey!!! I recognize some of those parts!!!!

Hey koko puff, yep you got a few parts on this ride. The rest are on my other Jato.

:-)


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[jarod_rodriguez]

Check your clutch spring

Yeah, that was the fist thing I suspected. I took the clutch bell off and indeed the spring was unhooked. I rehooked it and hopefully have it better connected this time. I put it all back together and it still will not start without patial throttle and wheels off ground. Once I let the throttle relax or put the wheels down to the ground it dies.

Next ideas please,

:-)

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Mind_Reader7]

Yeah, that was the fist thing I suspected. I took the clutch bell off and indeed the spring was unhooked. I rehooked it and hopefully have it better connected this time. I put it all back together and it still will not start without patial throttle and wheels off ground. Once I let the throttle relax or put the wheels down to the ground it dies.

Next ideas please,

:-)

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Well, even though the clutch spring was unhooked, what kind if shape was it in? It should be fairly tight around the pads.

Open the idle screw a bit more, and turn the LSN 1/8 in.

[jarod_rodriguez]

I don't like the spring compared to the Traxxas one. I might switch it out for the Traxxas X model. They seem more heavy duty and have a much better hook on the end. However, the spring looked to be in good shape as well as the pads. No use really. I will open the idle screw to be around 1.2 1.5mm. and adjust the HSN to be around 4.25 turns out.

[Mind_Reader7]

I don't like the spring compared to the Traxxas one. I might switch it out for the Traxxas X model. They seem more heavy duty and have a much better hook on the end. However, the spring looked to be in good shape as well as the pads. No use really. I will open the idle screw to be around 1.2 1.5mm. and adjust the HSN to be around 4.25 turns out.

You want to open the idle screw, and tighten the LSN. 4.25 turns out on the HSN is heaps anyhow, try tightening that a bit.

[jarod_rodriguez]

Ok, I meant LSN. Was a bit early when I responded. Need more coffee. :-)


--
Nitro-J-Rod

[jarod_rodriguez]

Yeah!!!, I finally got it going... It wasn't without much consternation. I eventually took the spur gear and clutch bell off the truck so I could work on the unit without it going nuts on me. This was actually the best thing I have ever tried while tuning. I was able to touch the throttle and turn HSN/LSN and idle screws on the fly and push fuel through the lines without having to worry about it killing anyone. What I found out was this. The idle and HSN were way off from factory spec. The LSN was off a bit. I ended up opening the idle all the way. probably 2 - 2.5mm at least. Maybe more, but the HSN was probably 2.75 - 3 full turns out from closed and the LSN was probably 1.25 - 1.5 turns out from closed. Still have some more tuning to do, but at least it idles on start and has really good response off the line as well as solid top end without stales and good smoke. Need to have it shift a bit sooner, but all-in-all I think i have it licked now. Great lessons learned here. Tuning a nitro motor is so much more of an art and not a science and don't always trust factory defaults.

[povchrisw]

that has to be the best Jato iv seen yet. what diff weight and shock weight are you running? cant wait for more updates on this project

[jarod_rodriguez]

Thanks povchrisw! The shock brand/wt. is Factory Team 40wt. The springs are tan in the front, silver in the rear (Traxxass GTR)

[ckysmith2011]

What tires are you running on that? Couldn't find the name anywhere.

[povchrisw]

What tires are you running on that? Couldn't find the name anywhere.

They are proline badlands, and they hook up great

[jarod_rodriguez]

Yep, PL - 2.8" Badlands they are. Mounted on Traxxas split spoke rims. Picked these up from a forum member on the market place. Rims have been de-chromed and dyed black. Although, I need to dye them again. I soaked them in acetone again to reglue the tires and some of the dye came off.

[Jersey Jato]

What ofna carb do u have?

[jarod_rodriguez]

What ofna carb do u have?

Honestly, I don't recall. I bought it used from koko_puff in the market place. I do know if are you using the EZ-Start system the slide bumps it and hangs on return. I need to adjust some stuff or use a pull start. I think it is the one that goes on the .25/.26 motor if I had to guess.

[jarod_rodriguez]

I am a little perplexed as to why I have to have the carb open so much to get it started and to idle. Any thoughts? It will not run any other way right now.

When at idle it sounds nice and response off the line even after long idle time is instantaneous. Should I not worry about?




--
Nitro-J-Rod

[povchrisw]

is break in all done? how long will it idle for? if it idles for more than 2 min and is still punchy i wouldn't worry about it as long as temps/ smoke trail are all good.. you gunna do some vids for us?

[jarod_rodriguez]

Yes, break-in is all done. The motor was used and had scoring on the piston/sleeve but still looked brand new. If it doesn't last long, no harm no foul. I will buy a new motor and be done with it. My guess is the previous owner was new to nitro and had the same challenges I had getting it to run and just traded it in thinking it was bad. Could be a funky carb but no one will ever really know.

It will idle for at least 2 minutes, probably an entire tank if I let it. I am using some funky fuel right now, the guy at the LHS gave me a quart to try. He doesn't currently sell it so he wanted someone to try it out. The oil content is ridiculously high. I haven't seen any fuel this oily. I normally run O'Donnell's speed blend, which is really oily IMO but this is even more so. You can lean it way out before you loose any smoke at all. Power seems steady all the way through the tank and doesn't lean out on its own as it gets low.

I will take some vids soon, need my buddy to run with me and he is out of town for about another week.

[doug148877]

steel gear tranny won't last ... it's metal on metal with no lubrication. which spring are you using? i use to run beige front and i believe blue back with 35 wt in the front and 35 wt in the rear.

They will indeed last forever, especially compared to plastic or aluminum. Like Mind Reader7 mentioned, you need to put a small amount of lube on them. I've run mine in my Jato since I first purchased it in 2006, and that includes the abuse from a big-block Dynamite .28 that I had in there for awhile, as well as the modded traxxas 3.3 with OFNA Force .26 Carb that I've run ever since I took out the Dynamite.

[doug148877]

Time for an update! So I have been working on this now for a few months and I am finally almost done. Just ordered the last parts today. Here are some images of the work in progress. Once I get the last parts next week, I will finish it up and post the final shots before I bash it to death. Let me know what you think. Here is the build break down as best I recall:

• Traxxas Jato de-anodized chassis
• RC Screwz stainless steel screw kit for Jato 3.3
• Spektrum DSM2 3100SR receiver
• RPM A-arms (front and rear)
• RPM wide front bumper
• Traxxas red-alum turnbuckles (front and rear)
• Traxxas GTR shocks with red tubes
• Traxxas GTR dust boots
• Traxxas tan and silver GTR springs (front and rear)
• Traxxas Alum front caster blocks
• Traxxas Alum wheel spindles
• Traxxas Alum serrated lock nuts
• Traxxas Alum steel CVD's
• Traxxas Alum drag link
• Traxxas Split spoke rims (de-chromed and dyed black) with ProLine Bandlands
• Golden Horizons Alum front bulkhead
• Golden Horizons Alum front shock tower
• Golden Horizons Alum steering blocks (Traxxas ones on order, will replace later)
• Golden Horizons Alum brake servo horn
• Golden Horizons Alum cam lever
• Golden Horizons Alum throttle servo horn
• Integy 54T steel spur gear
• Integy graphite brake disc
• Integy steel braided fuel line
• Robinson Racing hardened steel clutch bell
• Robinson Racing titanium hinge pins
• MIP High Performance clutch shoes and springs
• ProTek RC ceramic speed clutch bearings
• ProTek RC sealed speed bearing set for front wheels
• ProTek LiPo 2S receiver battery
• TRX 3.3 racing motor with Motor Saver High Volume air filter
• Ofna carb to be installed after break-in (beast)
• Savox SC1268SG Digital - High Voltage-High Torque servos (steering and throttle/brake)
• THS Racing Jato Tuned Pipe
• Traxxas Jato ProGraphix Body (to be painted metallic blue)
• I am sure I forgot something...

Good choice on the MIP clutch shoes/spring - for the 3.3 it's a great setup. I tried running my M2C 3-shoe clutch and with the 3.3 I liked the MIP 2-shoes/spring clutch better. Kind of surprised me.
Don't wanna be "that guy" and start bashing, but Integy.....uuugh...
Can't go wrong with RPM - I didn't even realize it but they have a lifetime guarantee on their products. If you break something of theirs, just send it to 'em, and they'll send you a new one right back! The wide front bumper is a must on a Jato - all that speed translates into more stopping distance. And, when you're like me and forget that fact, you end up meeting things at high speed.
Can't go wrong with the Pro-line Badlands - one item I did end up upgrading after awhile was my rear wheel hub hexes. Pro-line makes rear aluminum 12mm hex's that mount with a set screw - I don't think they're actually advertised as being for the Jato (I believe they are listed under the Associated RC10B4.1) but they fit perfectly and are awesome.
Can't go wrong with Robinson Racing or the Motor Saver filter
With the OFNA carb you'll notice that it comes extremely close to your flywheel - you may have to turn the carb one way or the other slightly to make sure it doesn't rub. That, and you'll need to shorten your linkage a bit (the OFNA carb slide is much longer that the Traxxas carb/needle barrel). With the added power, mounting the battery in the mid chassis position is pretty much mandatory unless you're in a wheelie competition.
That being said....where's the wheelie bar?? You're going to need it! In fact, myself, as well as a few guys I know that have similar mods actually turned our wheelie bars over and re-installed them to keep the front wheels at least a little closer to the ground! Looks a little funky, but works much better and helps to keep the thing in semi-control.
Good job on the pull-start. You save so much weight that it feels like you have a modded engine after removing it! I went from the EZ-start, to a pull-start, to a roto-start backplate (that's even smaller than the pull-start, plus I'm lazy and the roto-start is great)
Only other item I'd recommend is a New Era rollbar/grab bar thingy - the added weight is actually very minimal. It attaches in three points and is ridiculously strong when compared to the stock plastic rollbar.
Other than that, sick job! What needle settings you running on the Force carb?
Anybody else figured out some new slick way to eliminate all of the steering slop on these bad boys??

[doug148877]

Yes, break-in is all done. The motor was used and had scoring on the piston/sleeve but still looked brand new. If it doesn't last long, no harm no foul. I will buy a new motor and be done with it. My guess is the previous owner was new to nitro and had the same challenges I had getting it to run and just traded it in thinking it was bad. Could be a funky carb but no one will ever really know.

It will idle for at least 2 minutes, probably an entire tank if I let it. I am using some funky fuel right now, the guy at the LHS gave me a quart to try. He doesn't currently sell it so he wanted someone to try it out. The oil content is ridiculously high. I haven't seen any fuel this oily. I normally run O'Donnell's speed blend, which is really oily IMO but this is even more so. You can lean it way out before you loose any smoke at all. Power seems steady all the way through the tank and doesn't lean out on its own as it gets low.

I will take some vids soon, need my buddy to run with me and he is out of town for about another week.

That either sounds like a fuel problem, or simply a fresh engine "problem"! In my experiences, I've found that a engine that was just broken in recently tends to be a little bit of a pain to get running for a few tanks. I'm not sure exactly why? With my engines that have been run quite a bit and have "loosened up" & don't have nearly as much pinch left as a new engine they seem to consistently start much easier compared to a fresh engine. Either that, or like I mentioned above, could be a fuel problem. It could be old/bad, or the high oil content could be the culprit. The oil % could also be what is throwing your needle settings all over the place. Excess oil left over in the crankcase may need to be burned off before it can get warm enough/cleaned out enough to start igniting the fuel?? Possibly try different brand/fresh fuel?? I could be 100% wrong on that though - by no means am I the authority on nitro engines. I normally stick to my favorite brand & never never never change.
Also, not sure if you read one of my other posts, but if you're having problems with your pull-starter go to an HPI roto-start. It's the best of both worlds - you get rid of all the weight of the EZ-start system and instead just have a simple little roto-start backplate. Then, if you're having tuning issues you don't have to pull-start the thing to death, just a quick hit of the roto-start button and you're up and running. On the Jato you will have to position the backplate so the roto-start slot is on the lower right (viewing the engine from the exhaust side). You'll also have to trim a small little piece off of the plastic side skirt thingy so you can get the roto-start wand in there to the backplate. There are roto-start backplates that are made to fit the Traxxas one-way bearings (you can get the HPI roto-start in a kit that comes with a backplate, but it requires a hexagon shaped one-way bearing). If you don't have a hex one-way bearing OFNA sells backplates that fit the Traxxas-shaped one-way bearing (The OFNA backplates are the exact same backplate as the HPI - the only difference is that you can get one with a main gear that fits the traxxas OWB). Your stick pack from your EZ-start hand held unit is the exact battery required for the roto-starter. Presto! Light weight car, plus electric starting!

[pheenom1x]

Here is my off road Jato minus the proline moabs with blacked out dish rims. Want to see my crazy off road action heres my famous off road Jato video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvzUxJ07Owg

[IMG][/IMG]

[X_Spurt]

Very, very nice build. I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

[jarod_rodriguez]

I have beat the heck out of this thing for at least 4-5 outings and it is tough as nails. Ripped the tail wing off yesterday and still no broken parts. Still having odd carb problems though. I think it is time for a new one.

[GvilleFloridaSlayer]

Sweet truck man!

[jarod_rodriguez]

Thanks FloridaSlayer. I need to get out and run the thing. It is sitting on the pit bench right now. I painted a new body last month but it didn't turn out at all like I had hoped. :-( Was going for Candy red but when I put a black backer paint on it, it turned a deep dark brownish red. Oh well, I am sure after some bashing it will be time for another body...

[Hugoboss]

Hope to see new Pics!!