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  1. #1
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    "Flipper" to right the car back to the wheels, anyone done it?

    I've been thinking more and more each day about this. I have a strong spare servo, and a third channel on my tx to operate it. I have a large property and my house is up on a hill with a deck over looking it all, I'd love nothing more than to rip the car around the property and not risk it flipping over.

    Anyone here seen anyone make a "flipper" ... something like a 6-12" bar that simply rotates and flips the car back on it's wheels. I'm thinking it would work best if it was on the side of the car - least damage happens to the side of the car, mostly frond and rear bumpers take all the heat.

    What do you think? What do you KNOW of them!? *cheers

  2. #2
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Jimmie Neutron's Avatar
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    I have thought of this myself... but I did not get any further than that. lol
    Whatever it is I just said... I could be wrong.

  3. #3
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    Lol, yea same here, was thinking of possible a half barrel cage is it just rolls to one side. haha, that would be one ugly car though.

    Thats a good idea though. I dont see why it wouldnt work. The only thing would be size constictions, and possibly weight. You said on the side? The servo would also need to be able to return it its original position each flip. With the 3rd channel, what type of activation is it? Ei. throttle trigger, and steering is the wheel. Is it a toggle switch?

  4. #4
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jimbo74's Avatar
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    i dont htink it will work, not without a lot of work, expense, and weight


    now... along those lines... i have seen an idea that does work, and doesn't completely look like crap..... someone used a rubber duck antenna, mounted in the middle of a rollcage, so no matter what, you would just drive it on 2 wheel touching until you got to something where you could make it roll back onto all 4

  5. #5
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    I thought of an actuator rod like you see on Mythbusters when they're looking for the natural frequency of a bridge. This one, however, would actuate very quickly in one direction with enough force to roll the car over. It wouldn't be efficient enough.

  6. #6
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    Kinda like a ball return mechanism on a indoor putting practice thingy. Good idea. It would probably need its own power source and capaciter to hold and discharge the charge needed to efficiently flip the car though.

  7. #7
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    I don't want to FLIP the car so much as push it back past it's side - so as to fall on it's wheels again.

    The 3rd channel is on my DX3E, you simply plug a servo in to the RX and it works fine. So mount the servo on the side of the car, with a bar of sorts... and you control the bar with the servo... it's not a slingshot, just... a bar that moves to push it back over. Once I find a nice enough bar - not really looking but will keep my eye open - I'll put this to the test. I am probably just going to order some sort of aluminum a-arm from a larger car, super light weight and strong and will look cool. It will run along the side of the body looking soooorrt of like a running bar/skid plate/side step thing.

  8. #8
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. thedreadedend's Avatar
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    I used a CC sv2/3800kv and a pair of 3s to flip mine over after rolling.
    I'm not a hatchet man! I'm a maggot!

  9. #9
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    Hahah yeah that definately WORKS it's just I don't want to scratch the heck out of my shell and certainly don't want to wreck the gears/drive line.

    MAN that car is though! Awesome

  10. #10
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. thedreadedend's Avatar
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    I here ya, I painted up 4 bodies for it, they all get scared up so it doesn't matter much to me. Besides it gives me a reason to paint another lol. I have the slipper set foe a touch of slip, just a quick squeal on a hard trigger pull. I don't snap shaft to often so I sold the cvd set I bought before I ever opened the packages. I also go a bit tight on mesh, the bb motor could care less if it tight and I don't chew off teeth either lol. Its geared at 32/50 right now, this video does nothing for showing its speed. It goes much faster!
    I'm not a hatchet man! I'm a maggot!

  11. #11
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    So I've found a bar that would work and have put something together in photoshop!

    http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/m...conceptBar.jpg

    A few mm here and there, it's pretty much exactly to scale.


  12. #12
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    Nice to hear about mesh! I mesh close too, BB here as well. I forgot about the slipper - completely, so yeah that probably works out very well for you! Awesome... bodies are on backorder so I wanna keep this one as pretty as long as I can haha!

  13. #13
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    Actually here's how I drew it in the concept:



    And here's how I think it would better fit after I realize the issue with taking the body off with it mounted the way I first made it.


  14. #14
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    Here's a video of how it will be controlled!



    (it's currently uploading but YouTube said that's what the link will be once it's up and processed)

    I just need to order that bar and those wheels, and give it a go! Turns out it works a lot better when placed vertically... I don't have to open it up and mess around with the gears. After some more careful consideration, having a hole in the body won't be that difficult at all, it'll just run the vertical length of the servo. The servo is a 100oz plastic gear thing, so I don't expect it to hold up, but it's a universal size, annnnnnnd I already have it anyway. No harm.
    Last edited by krallopian; 02-02-2012 at 03:23 PM.

  15. #15
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Jimmie Neutron's Avatar
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    Laying the servo down flat will give you a stronger mount.
    Whatever it is I just said... I could be wrong.

  16. #16
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    The issue with that is, there isn't anywhere to mount it. When it's vertical I have the chassis to mount DIRECTLY to - screws will go through the empty servo spot, there is at least 2 separate pieces of plastic to bite into there.

    As I've drawn it out, it won't flip it OVER, but it will force it on it's side, where I can then just give it throttle and turn and it should pull itself over.

    How would you go about mounting it if it was vertical? =)

  17. #17
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Jimmie Neutron's Avatar
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    I would use a couple of slices off some aluminum 90 angle stock...
    Bolt the angle to the chassis in 4 spots (2 spots each)...
    Then bolt the servo to the brackets in 4 spots (2 spots each)...
    Whatever it is I just said... I could be wrong.

  18. #18
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    There is such limited room in there for that it's almost impossible with this size servo - a size that has enough torque - when I find out that I can order these other parts, I'll figure out the best possible way to mount it so it looks clean, and is strong. Thanks for the input so far Jimmie =)

  19. #19
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Jimmie Neutron's Avatar
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    Looking forward to future posts!

    I'm not sure how much force will really be on the mount... I just know that the flatter the better for strength.

    I did an extensive servo search on that one site and found a few high torque 1/10 scale servos that were really short... I did not save any of these because it was not what I was looking for at the time, but might be something to look into.
    Whatever it is I just said... I could be wrong.

  20. #20
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    i think your idea looks ok, although be it pretty wonky, however i worry you will kill your arm when you try and turn the tires

  21. #21
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    Thanks Jimmie, I'll have to check out, "that one site" for sure! Haha, I know which one you mean.

    Jimbo; There is room to turn the tires when it is mounted vertically not when it is horizontal. So it looks like if this were to be done, it needs to be horizontal. The 100oz servo IS strong enough to lift the car up on it's side I've done a few tests, my concerns now are that the arm may be too thin and dig IN to wet grass or of course snow. On a hard enough surface it should be fine - I really wish I had an acceptable arm to use right now and start testing things out haha! Expensive stuff this aluminum... $30+ everywhere I'm looking, $4 for the plastic part.

    I think I'll have to use a metal horn on the servo, and connect the arm in two spots to the horn to make sure the servo doesn't just spin inside the arm. I have a bunch of plexiglass stock, I'll cut some up and see what I can come up with.

  22. #22
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    Flipper, schmipper... what you need is a FIN !!! Strap this baby to the roof and your inversion woes are a thing of the past !!!


    Orrr... if that's a little too low-tech for you... you can always strap on some BOOSTER ROCKETS!!!!! Just hit that red button and you are wheels down in a flash !!!



    And always remember... "If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy."

  23. #23
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    Hahah thanks Tim :P

    I've mocked up a version on an old chassis, and it works really well. Really well. The weight of the car is a big concern (big block and big VXL3S) buuut I have my CF stickered spoiler, so hopefully that helps with the weight! Hahah

    I cut up a small piece of plexiglass I had laying around and made a "bar" with it. What I've found will be an issue is the SERVO will constantly be trying to stop the bar from moving. SO, when it's at "down" position, it will bob up and down as the car hits bumps, and the servo will constantly be fighting it to make it zero itself. Soooo I COULD build a holder for it to prevent it from moving much, but that's one more thing to break in a roll over. I'll just need a very very durable/strong servo I guess.

    I have 150,000 bolts and even more nuts, and none of them are matching! Story of my life

  24. #24
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    .... oh golly gee, my LHS says this specific chassis brace bar isn't doing so hot until the end of February, same with those traxxas wheels. He does have the blue ones in stock, and does have a 300oz titanium servo in for $85. I'm THINKIN' I'm going to go in tomorrow and pick'm up. I'm really nervous, it's "body cutting" time again to make room for the servo!

    Looking at the Spektrum S6030
    Last edited by krallopian; 02-02-2012 at 05:57 PM.

  25. #25
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    I've done said research on that servodatabase site and there are some shorter ones, but for the price, availability and performance... nothing beats the S6030 from Spektrum.

    Regardless here's a quick video showing the thing hooked up to an old chassis and doing it's thang!


  26. #26
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    Ever think about carbon rod? Pretty stiff yet flex able enough to take an impact. 1/4" od should do.
    Nice design. Can't wait to see it completed. May have to make one myself.

  27. #27
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    Thanks Wiley! I noticed the screw that comes with the traxxas wheelie wheels is pretty long! I'm hoping I'll be able to mod it to work on the end. There's exactly enough room to use the S6030 servo, and at almost 300oz torque haha it's a beast! Some people have said they get momentary power loss with their SR300 receivers (the one I have) but I'll just have to wait and see. I wanted aluminum because of it's weight, I don't know where to go around here for some CF stock.

  28. #28
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    Check out mcmaster-carr online. Like 22 beans for 24"

  29. #29
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    So I did some math with the car and potential to lift it etc...


    vxl3s = 90 grams - 3.15oz
    vxl3m = 38 grams - 1.33oz
    Vehicle = 1085.66 grams - 38oz
    v380 = 140 grams - 4.94oz
    v3500 = 262 grams - 9.24oz
    lipo = 120 grams - 4.2 oz
    Car Weight Total VXL: 1085 grams
    Car Weight Total No ESC/Motor: 1085 179.13 = 905.87grams = 31.71oz
    Car Weight Total VXL3S / Velineon 3500 = 905.87grams + 352grams = 1257.87 grams = 44.03oz
    Car Weight + VXL 3S + Velineon 3500 + Battery = 48.23 oz
    48.23 ounces = 1.3672975 kilograms
    Servo = 20KG CM
    Servo with a rod of 16.5cm = 1.21kgcm

    Which means, it's UNDER rated even at 20kgcm, but it's so close I don't think it's going to hurt it for a long time. I picked 16.5cm because that's the size of that Back Chassis Brace I've used in the picture. HOWEVER being that the pivot point is about 0.5cm in that shortens the length to 16, which makes the load 1.25kgCm which is closer to the ~1.37kg weight of the car. And since this arm isn't going to be lifting the entire car's weight in the first place, this looks as though it actually won't be a problem at all!

    I'm writing this all out in hopes of someone making sense of it as I have and finding a detail I am missing.

    When the arm goes up it will force the car to tilt to one side resting at least 50% of the body weight on the wheels which makes it even easier for the servo to do it's job.

    Anyone see anything wrong with this? $85 is a lot for a servo to do this IMO, but with muscular dystrophy.. running around the hilly property to flip the car is simply out of the question.

    ** Edit **

    I can just shorten it to 14cm long and that'll give me ~1.43kgCm which is more than enough to lift the entire car off the ground.. all day! I just reeeaaallly want that rear chassis brace it's perfect!
    Last edited by krallopian; 02-02-2012 at 10:51 PM.

  30. #30
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    Great.

    So I picked up the servo, and it kills my RX. Immediately shuts down the system. What a dissapointment! It costs too much to ALSO buy a new RX so this is such a drag!!!! I've read "get bigger capacitors" so I'll look in to this buuuuut yeah not lookin' good.

  31. #31
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    I've just done some tests with various caps and even at 1000μF 25v it's enough to operate the servo, but if I sweep back and forth three + times, it'll kill the system. I put it in parallel with a large 3900μF 25v and it was fine... I had to go back and forth 15+ times to crash it. I would never do that in a real-world application and THUS... fixed.

    I'm updating with all these things so that in the future when someone else is trying to figure this out or has issues, hopefully this will help them out! From the idea, mounting position, servo types, weights, capacitor info etc..

    *cheers

    P.S. This servo is gorgeous!


  32. #32
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    I've seen one of the bug bodies when rolled it just goes on over until back on wheels. I don't have one, but from what I've
    heard and seen in vids. I'm gonna try it one day.

  33. #33
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jimbo74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firemandan View Post
    I've seen one of the bug bodies when rolled it just goes on over until back on wheels. I don't have one, but from what I've
    heard and seen in vids. I'm gonna try it one day.

    it improved the situation about 50% but it still goes turtle quite a bit

  34. #34
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    Yeah there are plenty of ways to make the car always land on it's feet but the project I want to tackle here is having it look stock, which looks great, and still be able to right itself.

    This isn't meant to FLING the car over or SHOOT it back to it's wheels, it's just mean to lift it up sideways, so that when I turn the wheel inwards and give it throttle, it'll pull itself back up.

    I didn't buy the traxxas wheels today they are WAY too big, there must be different sizes for the 1/8th and 1/16th though my LHS said there wasn't.

    Going to go buy the Spektrum capacitor tomorrow - $6 - so that if anything DOES go wrong they can't tell me it was *MY* capacitors doing it.

  35. #35
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    I can't wait to see how it turns out! I've been wanting someone to do this.

  36. #36
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    Your Merv is quite pristine looking. It hasnt seen concrete has it? Your body mounts are scratchless.

  37. #37
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    Shucks thanks Wiley haha I try NOT to flip it. That shiney looking part on the top of the mount is actually where it's been rubbed, it looks like "shine" in the picture but that's a flat edge.

    Here's an update with how thangs'r going:

    Here's the cap I bought form Spektrum, again I have 100 here but this one will allow me to say, "but I used YOUR equipment it's your fault my rx caught on fire"


    Here's how it sits inside the rx box: (that's the Spektrum SR300 outside of its case)



    Here's the metal I'm using to create a support bracket for the servo. The bottom is how it was from the hardware, the top one is how I've bent it up:



    Here's how it supports the servo:



    Here's how it mounts to the chassis:




    Clearly the bracket is still "rough" I need to sand it, drill the two screw holes, and maaaaaaybe paint it.

  38. #38
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    Soooo I got it all installed, but the plexiglass just bends. So I put a bar along it and NOW I found this:

    DIFFERENTIALS!

    So when its on its side and I give it gas, the two wheels that AREN'T on the ground spin!! Sure I could put thicker diff oil in, but then I sacrifice handling.

    Hmmmm

    After further testing I broke the servo horn in half. Too much torque on this servo heh. *siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigh*

  39. #39
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    After some playing around trying to "jolt" the diffs, I've come up with this solution:

    http://youtu.be/0ltgaqj2n5o

    This way there's no serious rubbing on the ground thus no scratching of the shell, and there's no jolting of the drive train.

    I simply gas it in reverse, turn the wheels, pop the flipper and it's good!

    Now I need to make the arm slightly longer, lighter, and figure out how to slightly stiffen the diffs.

    Last edited by krallopian; 02-04-2012 at 05:03 PM.

  40. #40
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    Here's another video - I'm assuming people are watching this thread, or will be curious one day - showing the arm up close and the servo lifting the body up as best I could make it do with only one hand. All these photos and videos are from my Samsung S2 sorry for the quality.


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