testing my new outrunner

[ducati777]

My outrunner arrived, and the install was pretty straight forward. I needed 6.5 mm bullets, and the LHS had them!

Had some trouble at first with the pinion staying on. I dremeled the shaft a bit more and now its seated.




This is a crazy looking motor.



I absolutely love how it drives. The motor has a lot less braking, and almost a flywheel feel to it. The truck will coast very smoothly to a stop.

I changed the gearing when I installed the motor. The bearing on the spur felt gritty, I put in a new one and took a loot at the clutch.



Wow... I do like how my slipper has been set, but that looks really worn. Theres still plenty of thickness in the pads. I put it back in, but I could use a new set of pads.

Seat of the pants, top speed felt about 30, rc calc says I'm geared ~27 mph.

But the ability to crawl now is great, I can push and climb smoothly at low speeds.

The downside....

I'm getting some weird vibration like cogging now. More testing is needed, last night on an easy walk through the neighborhood, it started cogging.

It'd still pull from a stop well, but mid speed it would buzz out. Hopefully I can get the reliability sorted out.


Later this morning:


Went for a run in the backyard, and at first it was perfect. Then a couple zips into the throttle and the terrible vibration came back.

I took the motor apart, and the magnets in the can have shifted forward and are rubbing the pink stationary ring of aluminum.

Now I'm thinking of gluing it all somehow.

[ArmyofDarkness]

Some red or green hi-temp threadloc is usually recommended for gluing the magnets inside a motor like that, should do the trick nicely. As for your cogging, raise the start power a notch or two with the castlelink and see how that works, it's often recommended for use with outrunners as they are harder to get spinning. Higher timing might help too, though take it a step at a time and check temps as you go.

[ducati777]

The perceived cogging was just the magnets rubbing. Threadlock is all? I was thinking some sort of thick epoxy.

[Foxprogt]

Nice motor...altho id hate to run that thing near any kind of dirt with all that openness exposing the inside of that motor. X( good luck

[ArmyofDarkness]

Threadloc, epoxy, same thing :P

So long as it's high-temp and designed for sticking metal it should be fine.

[ducati777]

I put thin ca glue down each valley between the magnets. Then I found some JB Kwik in my tools.

I tried to spread an even maybe 1/3 inch band along the ends of all the magnets.

Then, to gap the two better, I threw a teflon washer inbetween the can and the rear bearing.

I did some backyard testing on 3s. It'll go and go like this, temps were good, high 120's.

I'd really like to find an outerwears cover for this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tEuabKnOt0

[ArmyofDarkness]

An old pair of tights or stockings might work, just stretch a section of material over the rear of the can and secure it around the circumference with a ziptie or something- wont restrict airflow and shouldn't melt either.

[mamba max1]

Be sure to update how it runs.

What kv is the motor and what voltage are you running it one?

[ducati777]

Be sure to update how it runs.

What kv is the motor and what voltage are you running it one?

I guess I never did say....

Its an 800kv 42x58 mm outrunner by *******, on 6s.


For me at least, the ERBE with the MMM was my first 4 pole motor. It felt so smooth compared to the 2 pole setups I had used in the Slash.

Well the outrunner is 14 poles.

That means you can control it at much lower rpms than motors with fewer poles, thus the ability to crawl. Plus the ability to put down precise amounts of torque. Like you can go up a steep hill, stop and then continue. On the stock motor the glitch from starting from a stop usually makes it just wheelie over if its on a steep hill already.

In a way, it feels like a tractor. It can be really slow, and yet still push really hard with control. Or better yet, it FEELS like a brushed motor.

But I'm still having trouble getting it to be reliable. After sorta gluing the magnets I went to an open field. I blasted around at full throttle quite a bit as some endurance testing. 10 minutes into the run, I got the crazy vibration back again.



I took the motor apart, and the can keeps touching the stator. This pic was taken earlier, but you can see the slight rubbing on the magnets at the open end of the can already. I'm not sure how, the whole thing might be flexing. I just can't keep it running on 6s geared tall enough to be fun. Another option might be to gear it silly tall, like for 50 mph or so. That would really help keep the rpms low.

[mamba max1]

Hmmm, may have to pick an outrunner up just to mess around with.

[kirkhayes37]

Personally, it seems like this motor has had a problem from the moment you got it. Am I missing something?

[rag6]

With this much control available from outrunners, are they being used often in crawling?

[ducati777]

Hmmm, may have to pick an outrunner up from HK just to mess around with.

There's a few to choose from. I wanted the longest 42mm, at the highest kv. Now I'm thinking I might be willing to go down to a 36-37mm for a higher kv.

I'm curious about the ******* Typhoon 600H Heli Motor 1100kv. It looks fantastic, but I just spent 30 bucks on an outrunner! I don't need 2.

Personally, it seems like this motor has had a problem from the moment you got it. Am I missing something?

Well its tough to tell really. Its supposed to be turning a prop in an airplane. Thats an entirely different load requirement than trying to power a truck over rough terrain.

It does seem fishy. If it would just stay running, no rubbing of the can or magnets... I'd be really really pleased with the motor. I just love the feel of driving this setup.

But not if it won't run right... so the stock motor is back in the truck while I think about how to handle this one.

With this much control available from outrunners, are they being used often in crawling?

They should be... geeze if I were into crawling, and wanted to go brushless, an outrunner would be my only choice.

[mamba max1]

I'm looking at the KD600L. It's close enough to my 1518 in kv that I'm sure I could gear it up to be equivalent.

1400kv
58mm long
43mm wide


Edit: Just bought it. When I get it, I'll report on its performance. Wanted to try an outrunner in the rustler I used to have, but i never got around to it. Besides, its slow speed performance will make it great for trails where top end doesn't matter as much.

[BL-Bob]

I think your onto something Mr. Ducati with the prop being a different kind of load. With a prop pulling or pushing the airplane the shaft will experience the force on the same axis as the shaft or axial load. In your application the shaft is experiencing high side loading or radial load.

i wonder if outrunners have the correct bearings for high side loads?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrust_bearing

[ducati777]

I recently semi-restored an old Tamiya Frog. Its slow, but I get a big kick out of driving it. I've been enjoying it so much, I just put round-up on my backyard track again.

I did this last year, but didn't maintain it well. You can still see where the track is, but its no longer made of uniform grass. Also the track itself is quite lumpy, I'd prefer if it were nice and smooth. Then if I wanted to, I could seed in fall and go back to a normal lawn.

What I need now is a way to smooth out the race track. On baseball fields they drag around a metal net. On beaches they use a chain net thats like barbed wire. Professional graders use a large blade to cut the ground smooth.

I've got an idea of how to build a small grader, but then it needs to be towed around the track a bunch of times.

Enter the E Revo Outrunner Edition! I'm going to build a small drag, then gear the revo as low as I can, and then start lapping slowly. In my mind I'll end up with a clean smooth track, cut through perfect grass... I've got a long way to go, but it looks like the ERBE is going to turn into a lawn tractor.


I think I'll even bind it to my airplane radio, so that I can just set a throttle level and it will hold it on its own. If I get really carried away, I'll setup the FPV camera and plow the track while sitting on the couch inside.

[kirkhayes37]

I guess I never did say....

Its an 800kv 42x58 mm outrunner by *******, on 6s.


For me at least, the ERBE with the MMM was my first 4 pole motor. It felt so smooth compared to the 2 pole setups I had used in the Slash.

Well the outrunner is 14 poles.

That means you can control it at much lower rpms than motors with fewer poles, thus the ability to crawl. Plus the ability to put down precise amounts of torque. Like you can go up a steep hill, stop and then continue. On the stock motor the glitch from starting from a stop usually makes it just wheelie over if its on a steep hill already.

In a way, it feels like a tractor. It can be really slow, and yet still push really hard with control. Or better yet, it FEELS like a brushed motor.

But I'm still having trouble getting it to be reliable. After sorta gluing the magnets I went to an open field. I blasted around at full throttle quite a bit as some endurance testing. 10 minutes into the run, I got the crazy vibration back again.



I took the motor apart, and the can keeps touching the stator. This pic was taken earlier, but you can see the slight rubbing on the magnets at the open end of the can already. I'm not sure how, the whole thing might be flexing. I just can't keep it running on 6s geared tall enough to be fun. Another option might be to gear it silly tall, like for 50 mph or so. That would really help keep the rpms low.

I am totally confused by this motor... It looks like bearings are in the rotor...and I don't understand how the shaft turns.....there are no magnets on it....That motor looks so wierd to me.

[ArmyofDarkness]

^Outrunner noob

The inside of the can ( stator ) is fixed to the front endbell- this part doesnt move and is bolted to the motor mount.

The outside of the can ( including magnets and shaft ) is all one piece basically & spins around the stator; the shaft spins inside the bearings & sticks out the front ( and often the rear too ) of the motor like normal- the middle of the can and the rear spins.

Same principle as a regular BL inrunner motor but inside out, and the can is in 2 sections so that the shaft and rear part spins, the front part and stator doesnt..

[ducati777]

I am totally confused by this motor... It looks like bearings are in the rotor...and I don't understand how the shaft turns.....there are no magnets on it....That motor looks so wierd to me.

Funny stuff eh?

In a way its a step back. It used to be, brushed motors had the stator in the middle, and a single magnet in the can. Its kinda the same layout, but in a brushed motor there is typically only a 2 pole magnet. In this case, its a 14 pole setup.

Its almost like they took an old brushed motor and just bolted the stator down and let the can spin.

I didn't really understand outrunners either... thats why I bought one. Now that I've seen how it works... well it looks like a great design to me.

[87 GN]

I think I know the answer but I will ask anyway. NOObie
What ESC are you using??
Can you use these motors with EVX-2 ESC?? I might be looking for a diff motor than the brushed 775..
Thanks..

[ArmyofDarkness]

Its still a BL motor, you have to use a BL esc- they work the same way as regular BL motors do though choosing the right size & kv for an application is a little harder- they produce much more torque for any given size..

The MMM or something similar will work just fine with most of the smaller sized options suitable for a 1/8 truck- ideal really as you can adjust the timing and start power to get silky smooth start ups.

[ducati777]

Just ran half a pack...

Used the outrunner, geared it 13/65, ran 3s, used the airplane radio, and pulled a drag... which is a 1x1 foot piece of steel mesh, and I put 18 lbs of weight on top of it.

My goal is to use this to groom my racetrack smooth, and to grind up weeds.

I guess the radio is in heli mode, because I hit the 3d switch on accident and the truck took off at full throttle... which makes sense now that I think about it... I worked the throttle but on a heli that would have only been the collective and not the throttle in 3d mode.

Anyway after I figured that out, I got the truck throttle on the plane throttle, and put the steering on the right stick. Both channels were reversed, so down was faster, and left was right. Took a second to figure out. But with this setup, full throttle is a brisk walking speed.

The truck did fine dragging the plow around. It was continuous duty at 100 percent throttle in the summer heat. Motor came back 145, ESC 120's.

It really is a tractor...

[87 GN]

Bump TTT upady up^^
6 pages back

[ducati777]

Last time I serviced the rear diff the oil in it was like a metallic paste. I'm pretty sure dragging all the heavy stuff around in this thread wore the gears a lot.

[ducati777]

I had a good run today. I put the outrinner in, geared 21/40 mod 1 gears. 30 mph on 6s. No crazy buzzing, it ran strong all day.

My father in law is living with us for a while. I turned him loose on 3s to learn. After a while we went 6s and had a blast. Dude needs to learn throttle control, but it was a good time.

[kirkhayes37]

^Outrunner noob

The inside of the can ( stator ) is fixed to the front endbell- this part doesnt move and is bolted to the motor mount.

The outside of the can ( including magnets and shaft ) is all one piece basically & spins around the stator; the shaft spins inside the bearings & sticks out the front ( and often the rear too ) of the motor like normal- the middle of the can and the rear spins.

Same principle as a regular BL inrunner motor but inside out, and the can is in 2 sections so that the shaft and rear part spins, the front part and stator doesnt..

Outrunner noob yes..., brushless no...I have 7 brushless vehicles...and Castle Creations and VXL stuff. never seen nor messed around with an outrunner. Not sure I would want the outside of the can wirring around on my vehicle where stuff could rub up against it.

My castle stuff rips and have never had an interest or need to gamble with anything else. That outrunner motor still looks freaky to me....but definately cool in the same breath. So what are the primary applications for outrunners. I dont see them with any vehicles around my parts of the woods.

Outrunners....haha..not too common over here in the U.S.

[Thalios]

So what are the primary applications for outrunners. I dont see them with any vehicles around my parts of the woods.

Outrunners....haha..not too common over here in the U.S.

All my helicopters are using outrunners. Much more torque and keeps the motor cooler.

[ducati777]

All my helicopters are using outrunners. Much more torque and keeps the motor cooler.

Yep, heli's and planes. Outrunners are good at spinning a prop, something that takes more torque than rpm, and its a steady load.

After bashing pretty hard this weekend, I'm back to being friends with the outrunner. It does look like gravel is dinging up the can.



But so far the dust hasn't slowed it down. I still want taller gearing, but I think I've maxed out what can be done with the stock motor mount.