ARGH, what now? neu-castle motor trouble

[brett_dirtbike]

so i soldered up a series adaptor for my MMM so i could run two of my slash 3s packs in series (i wanted to see how much power 6s is).. i get it all done and plug it in, give it a couple revs on the bench, WOW, then head outside

did two pretty fast runs down my driveway doing wheelies and then the truck stops, motor stutters like crazy when i try to go forward or reverse.. no binding in the drivetrain or transmission

take it inside, take the motor off and try it again, still stutters and doesnt want to spin, so i turn the system off and spin the pinion with my finger, the usual strong magnetism, but no binding or anything off so i dont think the rotor has come undone

i will post a video in a few minutes, my camcorder battery is dead ATM

[BrianG]

Check your motor connections.

[brett_dirtbike]

motor connections are good on the ESC, the wires were soldered to the motor at the factory, how could i check these?

heres a video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMv1MKuxnqs

[FreakyT333]

Have you opened it up and looked at the com, windings and magnets to make sure nothing is broken and loose? Also could be a siezed bearing but I doubt it, I'm thinking you have a problem with an internal connection of some sort and need to call Castle- I hope your under warranty still.... If not its only 70$ for a new one which isn't too bad for a 150$ motor. Sorry to hear man... Oh and you tripple checked your wiring correct? Its a possibility that your esc could be the problem as well, if you can test another motor on it or vise versa that will rule that out at least.

[brett_dirtbike]

i havent opened the motor yet, the truck was running awesome yesterday when i practised at the track, and has been going strong on 4s ever since i bought it.. but suddenly stopped working within the first 30 seconds of using 6s!!

i will open the ESC and check the connections.. i cleaned the fan yesterday so maybe i loosened one of the female connectors on the board

[brett_dirtbike]

everything in the ESC appears fine, but when i opened the case i got a whiff of burnt pastic/fried electronics smell

well, i guess i'll be sending castle my 3rd MMM, maybe time to upgrade to tekin??

[FreakyT333]

Dang that's too bad, is it possible you had some faulty wiring somewhere that may have caused the problem? When you soldered your series connection on could one of the connections inside have heated up maybe coming unsoldered - I don't know just trying to think of possibilities because I'm starting to really wonder just how many of these mmm failures are due to a bad esc (with everyone not just you). I'm not saying you screwed it up but it might have been the case here. I wouldn't think you need to switch to a Tekin unless you want that system instead, the Tekin will also fry if something is done incorrectly.

[BrianG]

Judging by the burnt smell and motor behavior, sounds like an ESC phase burnt out.

Gotta remember that stepping up to 6s from 4s without changing the gearing will pull 50% more current, and will be harder on the ESC, especially when doing high power starts for wheelies. Not saying you shouldn't do them, but maybe gear down depending on where you were before.

[Rusteh101]

What size gearing were you trying to run? That pinion looks big for 6s! A complete setup of wheels, tires and gearing would be useful.

[brett_dirtbike]

the series adaptor is the same adaptor that i have been using to charge my two pairs of 4s packs in series for over a year, and it still works perfectly, made with 10g castle wire

all i did was solder two presoldered 6.5mm bullets and 10g wires (motor wires that i got last time castle replaced my MMM) to a deans plug.. solder joints are SOLID, i am a very good solderer

i did not do the wheelies from a stop, but rather from about 1/3 throttle up to 1/2 throttle.. i did not punch it by any means, took it very easy, first time using 6s

gearing is 23/65 with badlands MT tires, speed calculator says about 60 mph top speed.. batteries are two 5000 35c 3s packs in series.. so about 175 amps continuous

[asheck]

gearing is 23/65 with badlands MT tires, speed calculator says about 60 mph top speed..

I run 50, with 24/65 and Mashers, with 4s. IMO you were probably closer to 70, and were pulling more then 175 amps.

[Rusteh101]

That gearing sounds feasible for 6s with badlands, did you hit the brakes hard at all? You get a lot of voltage spikes when braking hard which could have fried a phase unit.

[brett_dirtbike]

i didnt get anywhere near full speed, didnt hit the brakes.. just drove to the end of my gravel driveway (only about 40 feet long), turned around then almost made it back when the truck stopped working

two small wheelies when i was driving away from myself, turned around and drove back and i wasnt even doing anything when the truck stopped, just coasting back towards me about to turn around again

i am not one to risk anything, i took it VERY easy for my first run on 6s.. too bad it resulted in a dead ESC

i hooked the ESC up to one of my VXL motors (only motor i have lying around) and massive stuttering.. then i plugged my 2200 motor into a VXL ESC and again, only stuttering, so im assuming both of these are dead

[asheck]

Well, I bet CC will take care of you.
The VXL will not run the 2200 right. So you can't use that as a basis of anything.

[FreakyT333]

From the set up and details you have posted it doesn't sound like anything was done wrong on your part, that's just too bad. I had good luck with Castle dealing with a motor issue this past week so I'm confident they will take care of you. I know what it feels like to sit around and wait for replacements (I'm doing that as we speak) so I'm sorry for you. Hope it all works out for you. Maybe the mmm just isn't up for the 6s challange?.?... It is weird and worrysome when these 6s+mmm tragedies are still popping up more than they should.

[brett_dirtbike]

thanks for the help guys, im sending my ESC and motor to castle tomorrow

i hope my VXL ESC comes back from traxxas soon (button got stuck, sent in for warranty repair) for my 2wd slash because now im down to only one working truck!!

[BIG-block]

Ahhhh, that sucks. My MMM never seemed to have any issues with running on 6S but it did run hotter than my Tekin on 6S. Tekin barley gets anywhere near warm on 6S and 17/54 gearing but the MMM was quite warm with same gearing.

Still though my MMM died while being connected to CC Link. I had no batteries connected at all. All the power it was getting was from my USB (which should only be about 5V) and somehow there was a small plume of smoke, after which everything stopped working.

When ou get you ESC back you might want to look into making or buying a capacitor bank for it. Should help it out a little, especially when running on 6S.

[Z3r0]

From the set up and details you have posted it doesn't sound like anything was done wrong on your part, that's just too bad. I had good luck with Castle dealing with a motor issue this past week so I'm confident they will take care of you. I know what it feels like to sit around and wait for replacements (I'm doing that as we speak) so I'm sorry for you. Hope it all works out for you. Maybe the mmm just isn't up for the 6s challange?.?... It is weird and worrysome when these 6s+mmm tragedies are still popping up more than they should.

hi just thought I would chime in my 0.0002c. I'm sorry to hear what happened. Hopefully castle can help sort you out.

What I can't figure out though is I've had my ERBE for nearly 9 months now. Out of the box, I went straight on 6s. Packs after packs after packs I would run it on full speed and brake hard too (cartwheels my favorite at full speed) and have been doing this constantly and my ERBE still works fine.

A lot of people seems to have problems but From my experience, my Stock MMM and motor can And does handle 6s (packs after packs). I think it's reliable. I've blown almost 4 sets of tires (yes 16 tires) already (yes blown them to bits at high speeds) running on 6s and my MMM is still fine.



IMHO maybe you just got a bad batch? Maybe your esc got used to 4s ?..... Or possibly gearing?

[Cultivate]

What batteries do you use Z3r0?

[makaveli72]

Maybe your esc got used to 4s

I think it got too used to 4S as well.

[Z3r0]

What batteries do you use Z3r0?

Hyperions 3s 35c

[makaveli72]

^^^ Awesome batts. As well as the TPs 5000/45C <--- which I prefer.

[brett_dirtbike]

i sent castle an e-mail asking whether or not i could get a mamba max pro (costs less) in return instead of a new monster.. looking to upgrade the slash 4x4

as a side note, i have been running dual 2650 30c 4s ***** packs in parallel in my ERBE for an entire year, and the moment i start using two MAXAMPS 5250 30c 3s packs in series, it quits... maybe the monster got too used to the cheap lipos

[BrianG]

The MMPro is a smaller, less capable ESC than the MMM. It is basically a 6s sensored version of the MM, which is good for around 80A. The MMM is good for around 120A.

[FreakyT333]

I would think if your looking to upgrade your Slash 4x4 an mmm would be a much better upgrade than the mmp. Unless you don't want to run the larger batteries in it which makes sense.

Maybe your esc did get used to 4s- kinda like if you buy a car from a grandma and run it hard the whole thing starts falling apart. I'm not sure I actually believe that but it can be your excuse. Just run your new mmm on 6s hard right off the bat- break it in with crazyness

[brett_dirtbike]

I would think if your looking to upgrade your Slash 4x4 an mmm would be a much better upgrade than the mmp. Unless you don't want to run the larger batteries in it which makes sense.

im racing the slash 4x4 on 2s only (no 3s allowed in 4x4 or 2wd SC trucks at local track, keeps things sane ) and a MMPro 4600 combo is arguably the best setup for 2s in a slash 4x4

[asheck]

and a MMPro 4600 combo is arguably the best setup for 2s in a slash 4x4

I'd have to say the MMP and a Novak HV motor, would be arguably better. Really, I can't think of a single thing that would make the 4600 better, unless they won't allow the HV motor.

[brett_dirtbike]

sorry asheck, i meant combo.. my bad

[asheck]

i meant combo.. my bad

There's no bad

Why not get seperate pieces?
I'm just curious as I have heard of heat issues with the 4600, and really think the Slash 4x4 needs a bigger motor, if going to be ran hard, like racing.

[Cultivate]

There's no bad

Why not get seperate pieces?
I'm just curious as I have heard of heat issues with the 4600, and really think the Slash 4x4 needs a bigger motor, if going to be ran hard, like racing.

I'm going to come to Kansas City sometimes Asheck and while I'm there... I'll show you hard to run hard. Texas style.

[asheck]

I'm going to come to Kansas City sometimes Asheck and while I'm there... I'll show you hard to run hard. Texas style.

Buddy, I'm Texan , born and bred. You can take the Texan, from Texas, but you can't take the Texas from a Texan. But come on, I'll show you how to bash, my style

[BrianG]

OFF TOPIC:

Asheck, as you are in KC, have you ever visited the CC facility?

[asheck]

Not since they moved it. But I was just thinking today about trying to set up a tour of the new place. You have any plans to visit the new place? It would be great of them to have a "open house day"

[BrianG]

No plans as of yet. The old place was pretty impressive for its size. Patrick himself gave me the tour. And I got to meet all the people I have "talked" to on the forums, which was neat.