Results 1 to 28 of 28
  1. #1
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    43

    Brushed vs brushless

    Very new to RC's and trying to understand some things about brushed vs brushless.

    I am concerned about live of brushed so was considering going brushless. True or false--is brushless waterproof?

    My son has a summit, me the maxx and we like to get wet and muddy. Do we stay brushed or go brushless?

  2. #2
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Noblesville,IN
    Posts
    1,039
    Brushed-waterproof Brushless- not waterproof. You can do things to make brushless "waterproof" but it will void warranty.
    BLEmaxx-3905
    Fam. last words-Hey yall watch this!

  3. #3
    RC poster
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    5
    I have brushed and brushless motors and neither one is totally water proof. They are water resistant to a point. A brushless motor is more resistant than the brushed motors. Brushless motors are totally enclosed, whereas, a brushed motor has openings. So, in my opinion, brushless is not truly waterproof but is much better than brushed. The power increase is awesome! Motor life is also longer. The only down side is you will break more factory parts. To answer your other question, yes, go brushless! Just don't let the wife know. It is not cheap! I hope this helps.

  4. #4
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    43
    J-DUB. Help me understand this---the brushless emax and slash claim to be water proof running the monster mamba. I am trying to get educated on how they are advertising brushless waterproof yet the post here claim the opposite. Please help---thanks

  5. #5
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    43
    Thanks Kicak

  6. #6
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    32
    To say it easy:

    The brushless E-maxx is NOT waterproff stock.

    The brushed E-maxx IS waterproff stock.

  7. #7
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Noblesville,IN
    Posts
    1,039
    The traxxas VXL system (in the slash) ARE waterproof and the mamba monster (in the maxx) is NOT waterproof. Yes brushless is the way to go but downside is the ESC isnt waterproof but most electronics are "splash proof" so if you do go through water then i would stay away from brushless.
    BLEmaxx-3905
    Fam. last words-Hey yall watch this!

  8. #8
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    43
    Still working on this learning curve. Just spent an hour at the hobby store asking more questions. Dealer indicated nothing is waterproof brushless or brushed. Says everything is just water resistant. Stated I could do the same things with the momba set up on the Emaxx as I do now. He said the same goes for my kids summit--I told him he drove it up a creek 200 feet over and under water--said he is lucky.

    Thoughts?

  9. #9
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Webster, New York
    Posts
    306
    Quote Originally Posted by Kicak
    I have brushed and brushless motors and neither one is totally water proof. They are water resistant to a point. A brushless motor is more resistant than the brushed motors. Brushless motors are totally enclosed, whereas, a brushed motor has openings. So, in my opinion, brushless is not truly waterproof but is much better than brushed. The power increase is awesome! Motor life is also longer. The only down side is you will break more factory parts. To answer your other question, yes, go brushless! Just don't let the wife know. It is not cheap! I hope this helps.
    i beg to differ. brushed motors are completely waterproof. thats why you can break in the brushes of a 540 modified motor by submerging in a cup of water. the water method is actually good for the motor because it has a wetstone effect on the brushes and they break in smoother.

  10. #10
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    43
    I'm getting a headache!

  11. #11
    RC Racer
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    109
    Quote Originally Posted by skyman
    I'm getting a headache!
    most everyone on the forum is responding to you the same way. do not get the brushless esc wet, no water. Pretend its your computer motherboard do you get that wet?

    with that said, traxxas does NOT advertise the brushless e-maxx as waterproof, only the brushed e-maxx is water proof. the slash is because it has a special waterproofed esc, and it is advertized as waterproof because it is.

    brushed motors are also waterproof. the 3905 brushed emaxx is waterproof i've driven mine through puddles and have been playing with it in the snow now for a couple months. i have seen the youtube videos where people break their motors in by completely submerging them in water also. this is BRUSHED motors. brushless motors can take a little water but not brushless ESC's like the mamba.

    look at the advertisements again. brushless e-maxx not waterproof. brushed e-maxx is waterproof. simple. perhaps the guy at the lhs doesn't know what he's talking about, or you miss understood him. either way the people on this forum will not tell you wrong. don't get brushless e-maxx wet or it will smoke and go poof and die a terrible death. brushed e-maxx on the other hand fully submerge it if you feel like it and it will not harm it. however it does add stress on it, if you notice going through a puddle it slows the truck down. so it can handle getting wet, but don't drive it through a lake.

  12. #12
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    43
    Someone just sent me this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jpSW50cobs

    I'd like to hear from someone who has tried it. Big scones or deep pockets

  13. #13
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Noblesville,IN
    Posts
    1,039
    IF you do that you will VOID any warranty the ESC has.
    BLEmaxx-3905
    Fam. last words-Hey yall watch this!

  14. #14
    RC Racer
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    133
    I just watched the video posted above. That stuff is awesome. Has anyone else done this? I finished watching SQUIRRELOD
    PUT A brushless motor in a cup of water and it works fine. BRUSHLESS MOTORS ARE WATERPROOF JUST LIKE BRUSHED. He puts the motor in the water at the end of the video. Please watch the video that I posted below. WATCH THE WHOLE VIDEO

    Reaper

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUSmKAvHyEk&feature=fvw
    Last edited by soulreaper; 01-23-2010 at 06:03 PM.

  15. #15
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hudson Valley, NY
    Posts
    1,802
    Like everyone else has said, the motors are all waterproof to an extent. Submerging in water and whatnot for extended periods will shorten overall life span, but casual running through snow and whatnot, hosing off at the end of the day won't do much to them.

    Only the VXL like in the rustler is waterproof, pretty much every other brushless ESC is not waterproof at all. To make them water resistant, you can do tricks like those youtube videos, but kiss your warranty good bye.


    If you're on a budget, it's not worth risking a brushless ESC with water, or risking your warranty by modifying it. You should just stick to brushed for wet situations to avoid the risk if you ask me.
    E-Maxx 3905 - Rustler 3707 - Slash 5805

  16. #16
    RC Competitor
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    Posts
    53
    ...interesting discussion here... sit back, have some popcorn, a Sam Adams... and watch the posts roll in.
    Rustler XL5, Emaxx 3906, Radio Shack RC boat

  17. #17
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    So. Cal
    Posts
    1,322
    It seems to me that the failure rate of brushless systems is fairly high without introducing water into the equation. Delicate electronic components do not like to get wet. Even a system advertised as “waterproof” will fail if just a small amount of moisture gets to these touchy little components.
    I can’t see the reasoning in spending $600 on a BL Emaxx and then insist on running it in conditions it wasn’t designed for. For those who think they have to run in water Traxxas has a nice line or RC boats.

    Sparky
    Sharpchuter 245
    Dyna Wide Glide

  18. #18
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    362
    Quote Originally Posted by mjosparky
    It seems to me that the failure rate of brushless systems is fairly high without introducing water into the equation. Delicate electronic components do not like to get wet. Even a system advertised as “waterproof” will fail if just a small amount of moisture gets to these touchy little components.
    I can’t see the reasoning in spending $600 on a BL Emaxx and then insist on running it in conditions it wasn’t designed for. For those who think they have to run in water Traxxas has a nice line or RC boats.

    Sparky
    That's not running "in" water, that's running "on" water.

    There's something satisfying about flying through puddles and driving in the rain. I enjoyed the heck out of that when I had my Slash.
    E-Maxx 3905 and 3906. :D

  19. #19
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,502
    Don't worry about the motor, whether it's brushed or brushless. That's not the issue. The issue is whether or not you have a waterproof ESC. I have a Summit and a Rustler VXL, both with waterproof ESC's. The Summit has a brushed motor. I, and everyone else who has one, run it hard in the snow. Many of us have posted pics and video of our trucks being completely caked in snow - all of the electronics, the motor, and ESC. It's not a problem. And after I run it in snow, I completely rinse the entire truck in the shower. My Rustler VXL has a brushless motor with a waterproof ESC. This truck has no business running in snow. I've never tried it. But I have rinsed it in the shower, same as my Summit, and haven't had any problems.

    If you have an R/C with a waterproof electronic speed control, and waterproof servos, you're set. But of course, common sense must be used. Totally submerging an R/C in water is foolish for many reasons. And while there may be the potential for things to go wrong when you mix water and electronics, if your ESC/servos are waterproof, you'll be as well protected as you can be.
    ◄▲▼► SUMMIT ●○●○● 2 RUSTLER VXL's ●○●○● MERV ◄▲▼►

  20. #20
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    So. Cal
    Posts
    1,322
    That's not running "in" water, that's running "on" water.
    Nothing runs “on” water. Once the surface tension is broken it is “in” the water. How far it is in the water depends on its speed and specific gravity.

    Don't worry about the motor, whether it's brushed or brushless. That's not the issue.
    Not even the sensor board and connection on the motor side?

    Sparky
    Sharpchuter 245
    Dyna Wide Glide

  21. #21
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,502
    Are you suggesting brushless motors can't get wet?
    ◄▲▼► SUMMIT ●○●○● 2 RUSTLER VXL's ●○●○● MERV ◄▲▼►

  22. #22
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Medway MA
    Posts
    2,104
    The motors DONT matter it they get wet. Its the escs. Only traxxas makes a waterproof esc. People have dont twin vxl systems in their maxxes and get the same as a mamba monster but it costs a little more.
    Nothin' like a 4 on the floor and a V8

  23. #23
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    So. Cal
    Posts
    1,322
    Quote Originally Posted by Jay 313
    Are you suggesting brushless motors can't get wet?
    Are you suggesting there is no problem getting a brushless wet? I am saying it is a lot smarter to follow the manufactures recommendation when using one of their products. If it won’t do what you want to do maybe it’s because it wasn’t designed to.

    Sparky
    Sharpchuter 245
    Dyna Wide Glide

  24. #24
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,502
    Quote Originally Posted by mjosparky
    Are you suggesting there is no problem getting a brushless wet? I am saying it is a lot smarter to follow the manufactures recommendation when using one of their products. If it won’t do what you want to do maybe it’s because it wasn’t designed to.

    Sparky
    Depending on just how wet we're talking about, yes, I am suggesting that they can get wet without issues.

    As far as the manufacturers recommendations, I compared the manuals of my Summit and Rustler VXL. Under the "Running In Wet Conditions" section, the text is the same - aside from one saying Titan 775 and the other saying Velineon. Naturally, to cover their own butts, Traxxas includes a warning that extra care is needed after running in wet conditions. But both manuals actually suggest regearing for running through water.

    Are you correct to say that NOT getting it wet completely eliminates any possibility of premature motor wear due to water damage? Absolutely.

    Am I correct to say that you don't need to bring a brushless truck with waterproof electronics to a screeching halt if you come across a puddle? Absolutely.
    ◄▲▼► SUMMIT ●○●○● 2 RUSTLER VXL's ●○●○● MERV ◄▲▼►

  25. #25
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    So. Cal
    Posts
    1,322
    I am suggesting that they can get wet without issues.
    Traxxas, the manufacture, does not seem to agree with you.

    • Even casual water contact can reduce the life of your motor.

    Velineon motor life can be greatly reduced in mud and water.

    Titan motor life can be greatly reduced in mud and water.
    Sharpchuter 245
    Dyna Wide Glide

  26. #26
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,502
    One more time:

    As far as the manufacturers recommendations, I compared the manuals of my Summit and Rustler VXL. Under the "Running In Wet Conditions" section, the text is the same - aside from one saying Titan 775 and the other saying Velineon. Naturally, to cover their own butts, Traxxas includes a warning that extra care is needed after running in wet conditions. But both manuals actually suggest regearing for running through water.

    We can conveniently select excerpts from the manual that coincide with our own points of view forever and get nowhere, so that is pointless.

    Everyone is free to do (or not do) whatever they choose with their trucks. But I can't help but notice that you're the only one out of all the people who've posted in this thread that is saying that brushless motors can't get wet.
    ◄▲▼► SUMMIT ●○●○● 2 RUSTLER VXL's ●○●○● MERV ◄▲▼►

  27. #27
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    So. Cal
    Posts
    1,322
    Everyone is free to do (or not do) whatever they choose with their trucks. But I can't help but notice that you're the only one out of all the people who've posted in this thread that is saying that brushless motors can't get wet.
    You are right, everyone is free to run their truck as they see fit. But since it appears that a large percentage don’t bother reading manual and take what is posted here as fact I thought it would be good if they had real facts. You posted “I am suggesting that they can get wet without issues.” That is your opinion not a fact. As you pointed out it is a fact that the wording in manuals for both brushed and brushless models is the same. And it is a fact that the wording includes this statement, “• Even casual water contact can reduce the life of your motor.”. Velineon motor life can be greatly reduced in mud and water. Titan motor life can be greatly reduced in mud and water. The reason I “conveniently selected excerpts” was to stay on topic which is wet motors. While you can fail to acknowledge these statements it is a fact that Traxxas thinks getting you motor wet is not a good idea.
    Now armed with these facts if someone wants to run their truck in water I say go for it. But if the motor turns to toast they shouldn't come on hear and whine that Traxxas owes them a motor.

    Sparky
    Sharpchuter 245
    Dyna Wide Glide

  28. #28
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    2,502
    Quote Originally Posted by mjosparky
    You are right, everyone is free to run their truck as they see fit. But since it appears that a large percentage don’t bother reading manual and take what is posted here as fact I thought it would be good if they had real facts. You posted “I am suggesting that they can get wet without issues.” That is your opinion not a fact. As you pointed out it is a fact that the wording in manuals for both brushed and brushless models is the same. And it is a fact that the wording includes this statement, “• Even casual water contact can reduce the life of your motor.”. Velineon motor life can be greatly reduced in mud and water. Titan motor life can be greatly reduced in mud and water. The reason I “conveniently selected excerpts” was to stay on topic which is wet motors. While you can fail to acknowledge these statements it is a fact that Traxxas thinks getting you motor wet is not a good idea.
    Now armed with these facts if someone wants to run their truck in water I say go for it. But if the motor turns to toast they shouldn't come on hear and whine that Traxxas owes them a motor.

    Sparky
    When I said "conveniently selecting excerpts", I meant that's what we were both doing.

    I'm not disagreeing with with you on what you're saying it says in the manual. It does say that, and there's no denying that. But while I (and you) have an opinion on the matter, the fact that I (and many others) have got them wet and haven't had any problems is a fact.

    I agree that nobody should whine if they run into problems after running their electronics/motor through water. It's the risk you choose to take. But like I said, Traxxas is going to include the warnings you quoted exactly for that reason. But in real-world experience, I don't think it often becomes an issue. Like I said before, common sense still needs to be used. Taking a truck swimming is asking for trouble.

    I guess we're going to just have to agree to disagree here. Like I said before, if you choose not to get it wet at all, then yes, you completely eliminate any chance of water damage. But I'm speaking from experience when I say that a bit of water hasn't hurt my motors at all. But since I've already had a Titan 775 fail (not because of water) and they're cheap to replace, I'm less careful with that one than I am with the pricey Velineon. But some water on the outside of the can hasn't hurt anything.
    ◄▲▼► SUMMIT ●○●○● 2 RUSTLER VXL's ●○●○● MERV ◄▲▼►

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •