Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 40 of 173
  1. #1
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Pacific Northwest
    Posts
    635

    Diesel Engine Swap

    I'm not ready for the conversion yet but I'd eventually like to swap my nitro engine with a diesel engine. Call me crazy but my goal is to run biodiesel. I'm certainly green to the REVO and I've been out of the RC scene for quite a few years so I'm really not too sure what options I may or may not have. I know anything can be done if you have enough money but I'd rather not go bankrupt paying my local machine shop for custom RC parts. Any ideas from the community?

  2. #2
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Parsippany, NJ
    Posts
    1,193
    I'm sure you need a new carb. I know 2-stroke diesels were used in vehicles before so it can probably be done. If you can have a diesel engine in an r/c car then I would definitely want one. Nice torque and cheap fuel and long run times. Build it and they will come.

  3. #3
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    1,595
    I don't know if diesel would work well at all with such a small engine. I've never heard of a two stroke diesel. Maybe there is one out there - I do not know. That would leave going to a four stroke engine. I know they make four stroke RC engines, but to get the same power you need twice the displacement. The size of the engine alone would be difficult to incoporate into a Revo. (a .30-.40 heli engine..) Beyond that, if it is a glow style engine, it would require the oil to be mixed with the fuel. I do not know how well castor or synthetic castor would mix with diesel. The only way around that would be to acually make an engine like a 1:1 four stroke that has oil inside of it. There would be a lot of obstacles to over come - even getting a fuel that is potent enough to combust in an RC engine. Alcohol and Nitro can burn with much less oxygen than regular fuels - you can burn 3 times the amount of nitro per given volume of air than you can alcohol. I don't know the ratio for alcohol to diesel or gasoline - but I would assume it would be similar.

  4. #4
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    110

    .

    a looooong time ago there were diesiel r/cs i have heard about them, never seen them though.

  5. #5
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    110

    found this

    i found this they are airplane engines but it would definitley be possible...


    http://www.mini-chess.com/page/-MVVS...2050-34055.htm

  6. #6
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    1,595
    Gasoline (not diesel) burns about 1.5 times hotter than alcohol. I found a japanese website that has an RC engine called "diesel" but I don't know if it is a diesel engine. Oldskool - use the edit feature to edit your previous post instead of placing two posts in a row.
    Last edited by Staats; 01-19-2005 at 09:51 AM.

  7. #7
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    NEPA
    Posts
    3,793
    this post is really any good once the facts are out. first of all, how are you going to start it? diesels don't have "plugs" of any sort. second of all it runs on compression, and not combustion. another thing is your going to have to have to all gear since diesel engine don't like high rpms either. personally i think that this post it a cool idea, just unrealistic. and diesels are not two strokes btw.
    |N|i|t|r|o|m|e|t|h|a|n|e| - My anti-drug

  8. #8
    RC Racer
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    158
    whats the pros and cons of having a diesel engine??

    what about petrol engines??

    i understand its cheaper than nitro fuel, but does it increase runtime? if it does then its a great idea!

  9. #9
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    sacramento, california
    Posts
    687
    they do have diesel rc engines... there was some company called davis diesel or something.. they make converson kits to run diesel.. actually 2 stroke diesels work very good, because of the way diesel engines work, 2 strokes go very good with it. ok, found the site. http://www.davisdieseldevelopment.com/home.htm

    actually the fuel u need is pretty much the same price, i originally looked into this a while ago in hopes to find a cheaper fuel... this turned out to not be one...

  10. #10
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    1,595
    Thats pretty cool! It would be interesting to get some more specs...

  11. #11
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    S.E. Michigan
    Posts
    737
    Originally posted by tmaxxchump
    this post is really any good once the facts are out. first of all, how are you going to start it? diesels don't have "plugs" of any sort. second of all it runs on compression, and not combustion. another thing is your going to have to have to all gear since diesel engine don't like high rpms either. personally i think that this post it a cool idea, just unrealistic. and diesels are not two strokes btw.

    Diesels definately do have plugs, glow plugs very similar to RC,(my Kubota Tractor would very much disagree w/you)they definately do have 2-stroke diesels,there's a company here in Mich. that has been experimenting w/them for cars. Davis diesel has been at it for many years for rc.

  12. #12
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    NEPA
    Posts
    3,793
    yea glow plugs are for cold weather starts. other then that they run on COMPRESSION. and other then that they DO NOT LIKE high rpms. and if it sucha good idea... why isn't it catching on? it's not a realistic option for replacement motor. it's going to have to be a lot of spec changes. there is no pros to a diesel r/c engine. apparently i should look up more information... because i haven't heard of "r/c deisels" but personal experience says it's not a realistic choice. why do it, other then to say my r/c is diesel?
    |N|i|t|r|o|m|e|t|h|a|n|e| - My anti-drug

  13. #13
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    110

    ...

    tmaxxchump not to bash you but it seems to me like your just arguing based on nothing other than opinion... i def would prefer nitro over diesiel, i love nitro, but all im saying is maybe if you dont have the information and your just talking out of your ... maybe you shouldnt talk at all....

  14. #14
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    S.E. Michigan
    Posts
    737
    I know what they r for & what they do, u were the 1 sayin they don't have plugs of any kind, if ur gonna speak "once the facts are out", get ur facts straight!glow plugs would work in a 2-stroke diesel to start the motor.Some people just want to do something differant, there is reasons for it not goin "mainstream",but there r other streams.if everybody worried about mainstream no advances would ever be made. Look what Yamaha did w/the 4-stroke dirt bike,everybody laughed @ Yamaha & Doug Henry, now look at it!!

  15. #15
    RC Racer
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    146

    diesel

    As far as I know, the diesels in the links run on a mix of ether and diesel oil.

    For running on pure diesel you will need a big rotating mass, this is not wanted for rc cars, Further more, you need to inject the diesel in the cylinder when the cylinder almoast is at the top. This to compensate the compression differences through temperature differencres in air an engine temps.


    Good luck with manufacturing a diesel engine.... I will be surprised if it will work like a normal 2 stroke diesel.

  16. #16
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    1,595
    Lets not turn this into a flame war - I think the idea is cool, evenb if it wouldn't work - as a novelty...

  17. #17
    RC Racer
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Southern Indiana
    Posts
    181
    My 18 wheeler back when I used to drive had glow plugs (About 10 years ago). You hit the starter button, and it heats the glow plugs.

  18. #18
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    1,247
    Originally posted by tmaxxchump
    yea glow plugs are for cold weather starts. other then that they run on COMPRESSION. and other then that they DO NOT LIKE high rpms. and if it sucha good idea... why isn't it catching on? it's not a realistic option for replacement motor. it's going to have to be a lot of spec changes. there is no pros to a diesel r/c engine. apparently i should look up more information... because i haven't heard of "r/c deisels" but personal experience says it's not a realistic choice. why do it, other then to say my r/c is diesel?
    So do your nitro RC engines. The glow plug heats it up enough to get it to start the first time (like a diesel) and after that it runs purely off of the heat generated by the compression. It compresses the air enough to ignite the fuel, and then once the fuel ignites, it is like any other engine. You don't see any spark plug wires, do you? As for the two stroke diesels, most diesel locomotives are two stroke. (don't believe me? Check this site ) However, for small engines, it is easier to use a 4 stroke, as a 2 stroke diesel requires a turbo or supercharger. (maybe that thing from RB innovations does have a use after all ) A 2 stroke diesel also needs fuel injection. Overall, it looks like a 4 stroke is the only way to go for really small engines. Also, I see a huge advantage to a diesel - torque. The little two stroke nitro engines have huge rpm, with very little torque. A diesel would be much better at low end torque, even if it didn't rev very high. You could probably pull an incredibly high gear ratio with a diesel.

  19. #19
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Chicago-Lincoln Park
    Posts
    808

    If you have too much money....

    Hey, if you have too much money and don't know what to do with it send me a PM and I'll give you details on the 5th patent I'm pursuing. This one will actually make money!! (BTW the others are also)

  20. #20
    Banned by Warnings 72'dolphins's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Boca Raton, FL
    Posts
    3,450
    I think a diesel engine would be a very good idea. Reasons for it not going main stream are that it would most likely be a very high cost engine, and not suit most peoples needs. What do you want to do with it, I think a rock crawler would be great with a diesel.

  21. #21
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    1,595
    The RC airplane diesel engines are carburated, not fuel injected. Diesel doesn't have to be fuel injected or manifold injected - but it really helps it make more power. I think the diesel and crawling would be cool...

  22. #22
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    334

    Talking Re: Diesel Engine Swap

    Originally posted by evorevo
    I'm not ready for the conversion yet but I'd eventually like to swap my nitro engine with a diesel engine. Call me crazy but my goal is to run biodiesel. I'm certainly green to the REVO .......
    Excellent EvoRevo , i'v been thinking about this for ages but didn't know that mini desels even existed... One of the main resons i'd like this to manifest is the same as what u said ... key words being biodiesel and green , with all the replys no-one has even mentioned this.

    I love my Revo but i feel guilty when i'm using it as i know its killing the planet, its quite sad that ppl today dont seem to care, but they should as we cant go on like this for too much longer ( the planet is alredy fighting back with all the disasters )

    Sadly we may not see developent into this for a while, for the same reason why real full size cars arnit running biodiesel right now, theres too much MONEY to be made from "planet killing fuels" and the big boys at the top wont allow this...

    I hope some rich company or some poor genius starts looking into making these engines soon, its the only way to go.... (until we figure how to extract the free energy all around us, sun\wind elecric\magnitizem ect)

    Green Green Green....

    Ooo and did u know the diesel engine was invented to run of biodiesel ??? to the idea
    Last edited by EyeRevo; 01-19-2005 at 06:16 PM.

  23. #23
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    S.E. Michigan
    Posts
    737
    !!!!! Give me a BREAK!!!!Disasters have happened all through history, this is not the first!!!!!Get a clue!!! If u feel so guilty & r so upset that nobody does anything,step-up,get rid of ur revo & everyother combustion engine u have!!! Put-up or shut-up!!!

  24. #24
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Reno NV
    Posts
    777
    Wow
    OK
    I think the reason R/C diesel never took off is because they are hard to tune and keep in tune. If I rember right you adjust the compresion with a screw in the head. It does work but I don't know how good.

    like a few people have said there are full sized two stroke deisels. Detriots where two stroke they had intake ports and exhaust valves with a blower.

    [QUOTE]Originally posted by EyeRevo
    Ooo and did u know the diesel engine was invented to run of biodiesel ??? to the idea [/QUOTE
    Really?
    I would like to see where you got that info.
    Diesel engines have been around longer than gas.
    Look HERE
    lets not get this thread closed there is still a lot of miss informed people here.
    If they make it, I can brake it!

  25. #25
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Union,Mo.
    Posts
    1,673
    Originally posted by tmaxxchump
    this post is really any good once the facts are out. first of all, how are you going to start it? diesels don't have "plugs" of any sort. second of all it runs on compression, and not combustion. another thing is your going to have to have to all gear since diesel engine don't like high rpms either. personally i think that this post it a cool idea, just unrealistic. and diesels are not two strokes btw.


    Good article Wilde Racing i like reading the history of things like that

    a diesel engine uses compression to initiate combustion,they do not simply "Run on compession"if that was the case they wouldnt need fuel
    Sanding fiberglass subwoofer enclosures...AGAIN!

  26. #26
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Reno NV
    Posts
    777
    Originally posted by brokeitagain




    Good article Wilde Racing i like reading the history of things like that

    a diesel engine uses compression to initiate combustion,they do not simply "Run on compession"if that was the case they wouldnt need fuel
    Thanks.

    Yep ALL engines require four things to run, Fuel, Air, compression, and ignition. (From a spark plug, glow plug, the heat of compressed air, or the atomization of fuel injected into a compressed area (samething).)
    That is a good thing to ask yourself when your Revo wont run or start. "What is my engine missing?"
    If they make it, I can brake it!

  27. #27
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Union,Mo.
    Posts
    1,673
    that was one of the first things i was taught when i was learning about auto repair


    ALL engines require four things to run, Fuel, Air, compression, and ignition
    Sanding fiberglass subwoofer enclosures...AGAIN!

  28. #28
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    24
    Hey, are you spying on me evorevo?

    I am in the process of building a diesel RC car, using a Kyosho Ultima ST and a costom machined diesel head. I just need to redesign the fuel system, and find some fuel.

    The fuel is not actually diesel it is kerosene based with other things mixed in like amyl nitrate, ether, etc.

    Oil- 20% (Castor)
    Amyl nitrate- ~3% (I'm not sure on these numbers)
    Ether- %20-35%
    And the rest is kerosene or jet-A.

    *Note: these numbers are not accurate, just using them as an example.

    The engine does NOT use a glow plug. Instead they use a cylinder head with a "contra piston". this can be lowered or raised to adjust the compression by an adjustment screw threaded into the top of the cylinder. So the engine uses only the heat of the compressed fuel/air mixture to produce ignition. Ignition is achived at ~180 degrees farenhiet, at 18:1-20:1 compression ratios.

    I'll try and post some pics of the truck later.

  29. #29
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    NEPA
    Posts
    3,793
    alright, my appoligise. i really didn't think over the concept of the relationship between both motor about plugs and compression. i do still disaggree it's not logical, diesels don't like higher rpm. idk if the two strokes are the same or not. now that i really think, there is no difference between the two? now i'm confused. but i do want to appologize since i lost thoughts and made dumb comments.
    |N|i|t|r|o|m|e|t|h|a|n|e| - My anti-drug

  30. #30
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    24
    Originally posted by tmaxxchump
    alright, my appoligise. i really didn't think over the concept of the relationship between both motor about plugs and compression. i do still disaggree it's not logical, diesels don't like higher rpm. idk if the two strokes are the same or not. now that i really think, there is no difference between the two? now i'm confused. but i do want to appologize since i lost thoughts and made dumb comments.
    Actually, a conversion diesel (like we are talking about) will turn the same RPM as its glow powered predecessor.

    Edit: the reason for doing this is the added torque, fuel economy, and abnormality of a 2.5cc diesel engine... Seems logical to me!

    And now for the pics...


    Here you can see the entire chassis, note the starter.


    In this photo, you can see the adjustment screw for the contra piston.


    And this is just a pic of a caveman arm adjusting the compression.


    The buisiness end of a Davis Diesel O.S. .10 FP conversion head. The button in the center of the head is the contrapiston.
    Last edited by EDGE540; 01-19-2005 at 08:37 PM.

  31. #31
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Columbus Ohio
    Posts
    39
    What about Soy diesel (man made from corn I think) for a posability of a fuel source.I dont know what temp it combusts at but it does burn very very clean .we have have a few of the duramax chevy's at work and are getting around 4500 miles before the engine oil is even showing any signs of being dirty. I think it is up to 3.50 a gallon ( tad bit cheaper than nitro ) plus it would make the farmers and the tree huggers happy
    If you have more money in your Revo than your family car, You might be a Redneck

  32. #32
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    110

    ...

    niiice

  33. #33
    DaveR
    Guest

    Re: Re: Diesel Engine Swap

    Originally posted by EyeRevo

    Excellent EvoRevo , i'v been thinking about this for ages but didn't know that mini desels even existed... One of the main resons i'd like this to manifest is the same as what u said ... key words being biodiesel and green , with all the replys no-one has even mentioned this.

    I love my Revo but i feel guilty when i'm using it as i know its killing the planet, its quite sad that ppl today dont seem to care, but they should as we cant go on like this for too much longer ( the planet is alredy fighting back with all the disasters )
    Oh, brother.

    Nitro RCs are NOT killing the planet. Misinformed retoric like this does more harm than any nitro RCs.

    Good grief.

  34. #34
    RC Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    24
    Originally posted by RevonewB
    What about Soy diesel (man made from corn I think) for a posability of a fuel source.I dont know what temp it combusts at but it does burn very very clean .we have have a few of the duramax chevy's at work and are getting around 4500 miles before the engine oil is even showing any signs of being dirty. I think it is up to 3.50 a gallon ( tad bit cheaper than nitro ) plus it would make the farmers and the tree huggers happy
    Personally I would just stick to pre mixed, purpose made model diesel fuel. once you get the hang of tuning the "twice as hard to tune engine", then you can expirement with soy/Bio diesel.

    Plus, some of the ingredients you need to mix proper model fuel that will combust are not available to minors. eg. Amyl Nitrate.

  35. #35
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Pacific Northwest
    Posts
    635
    Originally posted by Staats
    Gasoline (not diesel) burns about 1.5 times hotter than alcohol. I found a japanese website that has an RC engine called "diesel" but I don't know if it is a diesel engine. Oldskool - use the edit feature to edit your previous post instead of placing two posts in a row.
    Do you have a link to the mentioned Japanese site?

    Originally posted by v2323
    whats the pros and cons of having a diesel engine??

    what about petrol engines??

    i understand its cheaper than nitro fuel, but does it increase runtime? if it does then its a great idea!
    Biodiesel is a renewable, environmentally friendly fuel. Aside from it's environmental perks I just think it's cool that standard diesel engines can run from vegetable oil. On top of that I like the general characteristics of the diesel engine, mainly high fuel efficiency, high torque and engine longevity. My quest is to see if these characteristics and fuels port over to the RC platform. If I can't get a diesel engine in my REVO I'll probably use a 4 stroke engine as a substitute.

    Originally posted by ghosthound8
    they do have diesel rc engines... there was some company called davis diesel or something.. they make converson kits to run diesel.. actually 2 stroke diesels work very good, because of the way diesel engines work, 2 strokes go very good with it. ok, found the site. http://www.davisdieseldevelopment.com/home.htm
    Thanks for the link! DDD seems like a great company. I sent them an email tonight to get the ball rolling. If they give me some insight I'll be sure to post it.

    Originally posted by 72'dolphins
    What do you want to do with it, I think a rock crawler would be great with a diesel.
    I want to do what most people do with their REVO, bash it! If I can pull away (in a race) from some nitro burners that would be cool too. :-) I think RC rock crawling is extremely cool but I'm not ready to travel down that (rocky) road yet. It's fun to be different.

    Originally posted by EyeRevo

    Excellent EvoRevo , i'v been thinking about this for ages but didn't know that mini desels even existed... One of the main resons i'd like this to manifest is the same as what u said ... key words being biodiesel and green , with all the replys no-one has even mentioned this...

    Ooo and did u know the diesel engine was invented to run of biodiesel ??? to the idea
    I can relate to your environmental concerns...

    Biodiesel didn't exist in the late 1800's when Rudolf Diesel invented the diesel engine. At that time he was running his engine using peanut oil as fuel. Today that type of fuel would be referred to as "SVO" or 'Straight Vegetable Oil". Biodiesel is the product of extracting glycerine from vegetable oil. SVO can be run in diesel autos with a small investment and minimal upgrades.


    Originally posted by TurtleRacing
    !!!!! Give me a BREAK!!!!Disasters have happened all through history, this is not the first!!!!!Get a clue!!! If u feel so guilty & r so upset that nobody does anything,step-up,get rid of ur revo & everyother combustion engine u have!!! Put-up or shut-up!!!
    Please observe the Traxxas "Online Community Behavior (Rules)" and "New Traxxas Warning System" which can be found on the start page of this forum. This is a place for friendly discussion. Thanks for your cooperation.

    Originally posted by EDGE540
    Hey, are you spying on me evorevo?

    I am in the process of building a diesel RC car, using a Kyosho Ultima ST and a costom machined diesel head. I just need to redesign the fuel system, and find some fuel...
    Nope I wasn't spying on you but I'm glad you found the post and began to share your knowledge. It's very much appreciated. I love the pics! When do you think your diesel Ultima will be up and running? Please keep us informed.

    Originally posted by RevonewB
    What about Soy diesel (man made from corn I think) for a posability of a fuel source...
    "SoyDiesel" is the same thing as biodiesel. It's fuel derived from any type of vegetable oil. It can even be made from animal fat. Corn oil would not typically be used because it yields a low volume of oil per acre. Rapeseed is the major crop for biodiesel in europe. One of the largest crops for biodiesel might someday be algae. Performa google search and you'll find some info.

    Originally posted by DaveR
    Oh, brother. Nitro RCs are NOT killing the planet. Misinformed retoric like this does more harm than any nitro RCs. Good grief.
    The burning of any common fuel in an engine or otherwise, creates pollution. No, nitro RC engines are not solely "killing the planet" but they are contributing to the pollution of our environment. We humans along with other living creatures depend on a certain air and water quality for healthy life. At a certain level of pollution our kind will cease to exist. Logic would then lead us to changing our ways in order to keep ourselves alive. Humans are pretty smart and if we chose to challenge ourselves instead of always taking the easy road we can probably live long happy lives. If you're healthy and live a long life you'll have more time to play with your toys.

  36. #36
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Misbehavin''s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    16,917
    Let's keep this discussion civil. I've removed a post and issued a warning due to a personal attack. Next time around I may simply forego any warnings and simply use the big red ban button instead.

    Discussion is fine, and is what this site is about. However flaming and personal attacks are not welcome, nor will they be tolerated.
    Be vewy vewy quiet,
    I'm hunting trolls...

  37. #37
    RC Champion
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Lincoln, NE: elevation 1200 ft
    Posts
    1,399
    Soy-biodiesel is made from SOYBEANS. Seriously if you are worried about an RC polluting the environment, you need to do some more research. If you drive a car, live in a house, etc. you are polluting the environment.

    I think a diesel rc would be extremely cool. But as I am sitting here drinking coffee from my styrofoam cup, I am really thinking that I prefer nitro.

  38. #38
    Banned by Warnings
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    334
    Nice info again Evorevo

    Yeah i thought biodiesel was veg-oil, i thought the name ment any earth-friendly diesel fuels...

    Hey if or when u get any info on putting one in a Revo please let me know, even if its months from now or if u get a 4 stroke to go in also let me know...please

    ThX

  39. #39
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Arkansas
    Posts
    327
    Listen to my advise cause i'm smrt!

  40. #40
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Misbehavin''s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    16,917
    I've just found it necessary to remove another post after my previous warning. Make no mistake, this is no place for a flame war over the environment. This is discussion of a project only.

    Any attempts to turn this into an argument, will be dealt with appropriately.
    Be vewy vewy quiet,
    I'm hunting trolls...

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •